Jeshin
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Post by Jeshin on Nov 22, 2015 13:46:41 GMT -5
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Nov 11, 2015 11:46:05 GMT -5
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Aug 7, 2015 0:46:21 GMT -5
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 27, 2015 20:10:13 GMT -5
 Maybe I was just disappointed that Donky (editor, I think) didn't take the time to post here like he did on TMC/TMS.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 27, 2015 12:23:17 GMT -5
Imaginary-Realities July Issuejournal.imaginary-realities.com/volume-07/issue-03/index.htmlNote: Imaginary-Realities and Optional Realities are not related in any way except that we provide them a linkback on our site due to the regretable name similarity. They are an awesome website when they do release content.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 27, 2015 11:23:17 GMT -5
Quick Note
While Armageddon may not have a legal course of action open to them due to chance of success, cost, or lack of interest in pursuing it. That doesn't mean they are completely without tools to bury a "rip-off" game. For example the diku license is pretty much 99.99% unenforced. Part of the license includes contacting the creators to inform them and blah blah blah blah. The majority of game owners do not do that and so they are technically violating the license agreement. No one cares.
The text-based gaming community does care when people try and use diku derived code for profit though. While I have yet to hear of a cease and desist letter being sent to games trying to profit off of non-profit codebases. I do know that the community blacklists those games pretty hardcore. It's one of the reasons that monetizing a MUD (even with a custom codebase) is still frowned upon by many people today.
TLDR - Armageddon could appeal to the greater text-based gaming community to blacklist a "rip-off" game that stole their codebase or their IP. That would be something they could succeed at and it'd depend on the exact situation whether anyone would care.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 27, 2015 8:44:25 GMT -5
In the US legal system you can do a lot of stupid shit that won't ever succeed. Luckily for a lot of people pursuing stupid shit in the US legal system costs money. A lot of law suits and legal cases are won on the expense of mounting a successful defense or prosecution. Armageddon's Staff have not displayed any desire to pursue legal means at all (because they would lose).
So sure they could come after you and you could tell them to pound sand. They can't prove damages to their non-existent income. They can't prove that Armageddon isn't just a fan modification of Dark Sun, thus derivative and free-use anyway lest WotC decide to re-open their case against them. The only incident where Armageddon staff might have a shot is if you had a mirror copy of their codebase and made 0 changes. 1999 copy of the codebase probably is significantly different from the 2015 version so... while I think it's kind of sleezy, you're probably safe.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 26, 2015 21:13:57 GMT -5
The question was: Does Armageddon have any recourse regarding copyright infringement?
Answer: They do not as a derivative work and a non-profit work on top of that. Those two factors would hamper any potential case that Armageddon's owner(s) could make at actually having another game shut down. If you use a literal mirror of the game, that would be slightly different.
Now is it ethical to create a MUD based off Armageddon with a different codebase that emulates the original? Meh. I wouldn't find it unethical seeing as the majority of text-based games are derivative of existing IPs with or without those IP owner's consents. I wouldn't personally do it.
EDIT
It is my understanding that Armageddon Staff sign some form of NDA/Contract. Considering Anaiah has publically violated her staff agreement, I would expect for her to have a lawsuit pending. As she does not (to my knowledge) I wouldn't expect any legal recourse against a non-profit game opening up that is derivative of Armageddon.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 26, 2015 19:47:13 GMT -5
They would have none. Armageddon is a derivative work and is operated under a diku licensed codebase. This means that it is by default non-profit (on top of being derivative). In addition the odds of Armageddon having a copyright of any sort is astronomically small.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 26, 2015 11:29:55 GMT -5
There is a difference between the competition of Burning Post II versus The Inquisition and Armageddon versus Shadows of Isildur. One is direct competition because it's the same setting/world/theme. The other is just the competition of RPI games competing for players.
People are passionate about ARM but if asked "What game would you make?" would they say Arm clone or would they say steampunk invention game!
I have about 10 7 people who have said they won't make accounts here or on Optional Realities because they're concerned their characters will be marginalized on Armageddon. Maybe those people are lying to me to spare me the pain of telling me they aren't interested in posting here or OR, but they do seem to read both websites.
New MUDs definitely happen! There are currently 4 games in some form of development which will hopefully be more public about stuff in the future. Of those 4 games, I expect one to see completion.
I'll give you that. It doesn't appear any RPI has managed to do what Arm does but better enough to draw players.
I never did play black sands which is why it was a question!
===
So my question to you is that are you interested in starting an Arm clone/inspired game? Are you asking purely hypothetically or are you testing the waters for interest? Would it surprise you to know that some former staffers from ARM are making their own games in different setting?
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 26, 2015 10:25:22 GMT -5
1. Why remake a game that already exists. You have built in competition from the start.
2. Most people when given the opportunity to make their own game would probably go with a project they are more passionate about.
3. Armageddon would most likely implement some kind of policy against players who played the knock off thus forcing people to choose between the two games.
4. The majority of MUD projects do not ever see completion. Look at Arm 2.0 by its own staff. Any such project has a high % of failure likely leading to many not bothering to invest the time.
5. Armageddon functions more because of its established playerbase and less because of its code or setting. It's a systemic problem for other games once they get down to X players online that they can't attract new players because they aren't populated enough. Not Armageddon.
6. Didn't someone already kind of try to do that with Black Sands?
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 16, 2015 19:00:23 GMT -5
Okay then yeah, arm might get 50 more players. If they did all that. I'll say this short because cellphone
More players would return if change happened than people who would leave. Would any player quit if a staffer got fired? What about a return to old ways of handling plots? Think anyone will leave if there was a public apology?
There is overwhelming upside to such actions.
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 16, 2015 18:29:37 GMT -5
It's a toss up. Is it an apology and no staff position changes? Is there a new mission statement put out? A new guide to staff professionalism? A new stance on hrpts and rpts in general?
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 16, 2015 9:21:02 GMT -5
Bite your tongue jcarter!
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Jul 12, 2015 11:53:22 GMT -5
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Maybe I was just disappointed that Donky (editor, I think) didn't take the time to post here like he did on TMC/TMS.