punished ppurg
GDB Superstar
Why are we still here? Just to suffer?
Posts: 1,035
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Post by punished ppurg on Oct 21, 2022 15:12:31 GMT -5
Delirium allegedly PERMABANNED from GDB for exposing Halaster's deceptions.
Presupposing the construct of a functioning bureaucracy, the end result of a veteran player being in such a state per se as Delirium's is an example of the failure of the bureaucracy. It is a remarkable example of the failure of the system; that is, if we presume that the system is designed to facilitate remediation or recourse with players. Clearly the system does not work with those objectives at the head: a system that sought those objectives would not be able to be satisfied with this result. There's only one logical conclusion: the suggestion of recourse through these request tickets is a falsehood. It's a lie that insulates the old boys club from valid criticism.
Psalms 101:7 No one who practices deceit will dwell in my house; no one who speaks falsely will stand in my presence.
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Oct 22, 2022 4:46:47 GMT -5
Delirium: *supposedly attacks the character of someone who can't defend himself* Staff: *ban her* Everyone else: Why was Delirium banned? Staff: *definitely attacks the character of someone who can't defend herself* Again: Armageddon players who see this stuff and think it's just normal community leader behavior are some of the dullest marks alive.
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punished ppurg
GDB Superstar
Why are we still here? Just to suffer?
Posts: 1,035
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Post by punished ppurg on Oct 22, 2022 5:21:53 GMT -5
Fortunately we were able to snag a full copy of the deleted post here. So there cannot be too much innuendo now as to what was supposedly said. It is remarkable how Halaster has no concept of inflicting the same wound that he's claiming to suffer from: it's within his power to apologize and make the veteran player whole, but he would rather systemically expel them from the Armageddon community entirely. It's degenerative. Like someone else mentioned, it's no wonder they're gearing towards bringing in new players: they don't offer the veterans the common courtesy or dignity one comes to expect from the blood, sweat, and tears put into a MUD port. Of course Arm is going to lose veterans, of course Arm's playerbase is going to dwindle.
Edit to add. Halaster was taking a PR lap in the discord talking about how they're going to open up all the noble clans (Wyverns Scorpions etc.) After kicking Delirium out. If I had written 1 string of content for those entities, I would be sick to my stomach that they're being bandied about as damage control. The carrot after the stick. This isn't respect. Shabago's invitation had the basic gestalt of a little respect. Halaster has completely shit the bed here in my opinion.
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Post by jcarter on Oct 22, 2022 10:35:56 GMT -5
halaster was a shithead 20 years ago and he's still a shithead. idk why anyone would expect differently especially when he just 'came back' on staff without any recognition of using his staff position to build custom shit for his characters and have a power advantage over his PC rivals.
arm players are getting exactly what they deserve. this awww shucks guys we want to reconcile song and dance has been played by one imm or another for the last 15+ years, and gets cut off whenever someone makes a directed criticism thats spicier than 'sometimes staff are not very nice'
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ibusoe
Clueless newb
Posts: 176
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Post by ibusoe on Oct 22, 2022 16:10:52 GMT -5
Last time I played, the game had grown so stagnant and boring that I couldn't force myself to keep playing even though I was between jobs at the time and had a month with nothing to do. I think that this says alot. Not that I even agree with most of what you have to say, but if anything I think that staff should do a private one on one interview with you and try to determine what could bring you back? Not because you're amazing. You are, but the reason they should do this is because in your situation you are the ideal demographic of someone with plenty of energy to throw into the game. I'm not against staff at all after my MUD failed to launch because I couldn't cut it in their game. But doesn't prudence indicate that they should reduce waste? You're the poster child for their retention problem. We don't need Game of Thrones reenacted in Zalanthas, just something that players can sink their teeth into. Armageddon managed to have that for years and years until one day it just stopped, and the only reason I can see is that staff simply decided not to have anything happen anymore. This one was possibly my fault. While I may not have progenated the idea of switching from staff-run plots to player, I certainly sounded that trumpet adequately. I remember that as the switch of which you speak. I think that staff should move to a hybrid system. Staff plots should be labeled as staff plots. So let's just be grateful that we've moved past the hypothesis that Hurricane Ian I don't know, I'd rather spend a minute to dwell on the fact that Shabago purportedly had enough faith in the possibility that Ian knocked people offline for any integral of time to give voice to it. My power was out for no more than 23 hours. He's a decision maker? Is he sure that he wants to view that as his forté?
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Post by Azerbanjani on Oct 23, 2022 19:18:00 GMT -5
Anyone who responds to the thread where staff have more or less admitted to having a problem with player retention to 'WHAT ABOUT BOTH SIDES?' and 'WHAT IF WE JUST PLAYED THE GAME AND HAD FUN?' when people are explaining they aren't having fun and aren't playing due to the staff are actually mentally ill.
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mehtastic
GDB Superstar
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Posts: 1,335
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Post by mehtastic on Oct 24, 2022 5:28:38 GMT -5
Karma timers removed on 10/16/22. The week of 10/10 - 10/17 had 163 unique logins.
The week before karma timers were removed, 10/3 - 10/10, had 151 unique logins. The first full week without karma timers, 10/17 - 10/24, had 160 logins.
My short-term take: the removal of karma timers will result in a short-term boost of interest immediately hampered by the facts that there is nothing going on in the game, and that most karma roles are inherently isolated and will not be able to roleplay with as many people, thus reducing the chances of getting involved in something happening even if there was something happening at all.
Removal of karma timers was the ultimate "just play the game and have fun!" of staff decisions and the fact of the matter is that a negligible number of people are taking the bait. Looking at roughly the same time last year (10/18/21 - 10/25/21) the game had 159 players.
Cue Shabago glancing at the numbers and declaring Diwali to be a historical lull period.
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ibusoe
Clueless newb
Posts: 176
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Post by ibusoe on Oct 24, 2022 7:57:40 GMT -5
Cue Shabago glancing at the numbers and declaring Diwali to be a historical lull period. "Sorry, we are taking the week off and we will be back online for our 'Byn run next week."Nice! Funny thing about all of this, is removing the karma regen cooldown isn't a policy maneuver, it's "deregulation." In other words, it's a hack. It won't help things long term because the people that were refusing to play because we won't let them play full mul/sorcs character after character were people that we were trying to jettison from the game: the true assholes. IMHO the elephant in the room is that staff from day one, God Bless 'em, never embraced the spirit that popular games need. In popular games like ....well, my pop culture knowlege is limited. Can I still use World of Warcraft as an example? In games like WoW, you have 30k players online at any one time precisely because you are allowed to go on to the forums and cuss out the staff. That's why bugs get fixed in games like WoW, because people complain ont the forums and then the devs fix the bugs that get complained about. I think that staff need to make a decision, do we want to play a "popular" style game that has a three digit player count, or a game with only their friends. Because if the rules require that new people (or anyone really) aren't allowed to say things on the forums like, "OMFG staff blows, I want to get an iron sword plz plz plz!!111" then this will alienate most online gamers. That's the way that fun young people are allowed to talk on social media, on the playground and on other video game forums. If we make our game stricter than high school, then we'll only have the prigs. Who else would put up with us? Unfortunately I feel inclined, and I shouldn't have to write this, to take a moment that historically snobs within the game have wanted to alienate the young gamer-bro type but really that should be our primary recruitment base, or rather young gamer people. If we recruit a 50 year old to play the game, like a really smart one? Hey, that's neat. Why not. But they won't invite ten of their friends. It's young people that do that. We need to restructure the rules so that people get in less trouble for behavior that's taking place outside the game.
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Post by Azerbanjani on Oct 24, 2022 13:07:09 GMT -5
Finally got banned. What controversial opinions led to this? Let's go over a few.
1: Telling people who have issues with the game to just ignore those issues and 'play the game' is stupid.
2: We should address sexual assault claims
3: Demonizing people who dislike the game is stupid.
Now I won't act like I'm some saint, I more or less implied anyone who held these beliefs were stupid and worth ridicule. If Shabago saw my claims and went 'THIS IS INSULTING TO ME/STAFF' then it is because he can't seperate himself from a hypothetical third party, or himself holds these views and is thus worthy of ridicule.
I also find it funny he implied I needed 'help a 3rd or 4th grader might need' for healthy discussion, which seems a bit toxic there Shabago? Maybe you should get muted for a bit to cool down? We don't allow meanie behavior in this community.
Anyway someone keep me up to date when there's another 'why aren't people playing the game anymore' thread so I can see it get worse later.
I'm also told I was referred to as a 'known griefer' and I've been 'warned many times before'. To which I say: 1: yes, you caught me. I played this game for hours upon hours, days upon days, to grief it. Ignoring all the RP I did. That one time I killed a npc templar without wishing up proves it! 2: I haven't really ever received warnings. I was banned once for meta gaming on here, told them I wouldn't again. Got unbanned.
Shalooonsh got mad I wasn't emoting while stealing. Told him I would.
Staff got pretty pissed I killed that Templar.
None of these are broad 'MANY WARNINGS' I just do stupid shit sometimes, or for some reason expect the staff who ignores me 99% of the time to keep doing so and don't see the need to emote to myself. But once again, demonize people who bring up dislikes to the game.
It's also almost ironic because me and Shabago at least share a common idea: You don't need to be nice or polite to dickwads.
However, he's a dickwad. And I don't see a need to be nice or polite to him. So then he gets it in his head I'm the problem.
The only difference here is one of us can ban people and it ain't me.
Ibusoe your posts are funny as fuck btw
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mehtastic
GDB Superstar
Armers Anonymous sponsor
Posts: 1,335
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Post by mehtastic on Oct 24, 2022 19:14:42 GMT -5
Great to see that after over 10 years, Shabago still has not matured a single day.
As for the people on the GDB now benefiting from my quick thinking at archiving Delirium's post, which has now been reposted in its entirety and remains undeleted by staff, you're fucking welcome.
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ibusoe
Clueless newb
Posts: 176
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Post by ibusoe on Oct 25, 2022 13:31:31 GMT -5
Ibusoe your posts are funny as fuck btw Thanks Bro!
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ibusoe
Clueless newb
Posts: 176
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Post by ibusoe on Oct 25, 2022 14:41:20 GMT -5
Yeah, Armageddon has no path to becoming a better game (at least not one that every single staff member can agree on). The thread shows as much.
Perhaps you are right, Friend. But if there is a path, here it be. Presenting the Ibusoe Reforms. Here's the outline, I'll flesh this out tomorrow or something. Expand the clan system Make the game social Open source most aspects of the ticketing system Implement payment system for both player contributors and staff Harden the game system Complete the elf revamp Move the GDB over to Reddit. That is to say, mothball the GDB Make punishments swifter and milder – avoid long-term player-staff grudges Update policy to address Pking Develop a training camp to help players deal with sensitive concepts Announce that players are allowed to use multiple characters to start a clan, & etc. Implement an inheritance system. Reduce game dependencies on secrecy Work on their policy regarding “roll outs” and deployments strengthen policies related to cry bullying and discipline reduce player dependence upon staff migrate to a better code base, keep old Arm running indefinitely develop policy to offer “opt out” options for people who don’t like particular changes enhance mediation for player conflict
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Post by Azerbanjani on Oct 25, 2022 15:04:33 GMT -5
Expand the clan system Make the game social Implement payment system for both player contributors and staff Harden the game system Complete the elf revamp Update policy to address Pking I know you're capable of spitting out rants that make Grumble look like he's short spoken but I was curious as to your thoughts on these that I've singled out? What you envision for the clan system, how you'd make the game more social, whatever the fuck the payment system would entail, 'hardening', an elf revamp, etc. Personally my list is somewhat of the following: 1: Revert many lore changes to be closer in line to a more realistic expectation of how a system would work, either historically, through better logical reasoning, or just copy pasting Dark Sun better. Reasoning: Armageddon has some stupid fucking lore and set up. The noble houses are clown circuses wearing different clothes, the merchant houses specialize perhaps too much for comfort, the Highlord is 'totally not a religion' but is a religion by virtue of how we NEVER see him. Un-fuck Psionics, un-fuck clerics, get rid of gemmed I hate that shit, etc. Basically this is the 'I disagree with a lot of how Armageddon does things and I'm a butt hurt baby boy' slot. 2: A lot of what you said rings true to me but I disagree with some, not to the extent or enough to talk about though (Stuff like the reddit thing. Fuck that noise) 3: Crime code needs a massive revamp but I almost want to say this is included in most changes. Perma-Crime code needs to be outright removed (But once again this is a 'Have less shit staff' situation) 4: We both need to enforce some parts of a Dark-Sun-like setting and remove others. Things that can be improved on? Race relations. I'm on the second book of Dark Sun and somehow this brutal slave society is less brutal than half of the interactions I have in Armageddon. Let's grow up. Most of us aren't authors. Most of us don't properly understand a standard distrust of other sentient races (Fantasy, not IRL). Any racism we do in Armageddon winds up being boring real life allegory racism that we might as well just be saying 'I don't like you darkie'. And while we can scream and cry at each other all day every day on whether or not that is okay to RP or even write about, something about free speech I really don't give a fuck write about it if you want, I think it's a far cry from what the racial tensions and dislikes of Dark Sun actually are. In Dark Sun you make an off comment about the trust worthiness of the breed in your group and then through time you work to give a damn about them and maybe they rise to the occasion. In Armageddon we shit talk the breed for 6 in game months and maybe one person shit talks them slightly less. Maybe that's more 'realistic' but it's still lame. Things that are alright already? May be a controversial one but water seems to be alright. You can find it in decent enough areas, it's hidden away, a skill can find some, you can buy it, it's alright. I actually think it's in a good amount for the setting/proper dark sun like. Add more metal god damn. 5: I don't know, there's a lot. The setting has a stagnant meta plot, staff has to go on the forums to talk about the 'exciting whole world player led plots' that are happening and meanwhile I get dms on discord going 'I've been playing in -place- for months, I haven't even heard of these plots'. The staff system is horribly designed.
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nile
Clueless newb
Posts: 87
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Post by nile on Oct 25, 2022 18:32:52 GMT -5
lol randomly found this. loooonsh you fucking idiot...
"Welcome back!
Very sorry to hear about Gaahl, I know this won't help, but I was waiting to find Gaahl online for an organic promotion to Glint. So please chalk it up as a win that your PC was to become the first Two Moons Glint. You did a tremendous job with the PC, and helped many players really grasp what it was to be a part of the tribe.
I love this new character, very cool sdesc, spooky-but-realistic mdesc, and I really hope they go far. You're a tremendous player, and very creative. Best of luck with this role!!!
-Shalooonsh"
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Post by Azerbanjani on Oct 25, 2022 18:37:21 GMT -5
lol randomly found this. loooonsh you fucking idiot... "Welcome back! Very sorry to hear about Gaahl, I know this won't help, but I was waiting to find Gaahl online for an organic promotion to Glint. So please chalk it up as a win that your PC was to become the first Two Moons Glint. You did a tremendous job with the PC, and helped many players really grasp what it was to be a part of the tribe. I love this new character, very cool sdesc, spooky-but-realistic mdesc, and I really hope they go far. You're a tremendous player, and very creative. Best of luck with this role!!! -Shalooonsh" Am I missing some context here or is Shaloonsh just really tone deaf going 'Haha you were going to get a promotion but you died!' and not seeing that that is NOT what someone wants to hear.
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