jkarr
GDB Superstar
Posts: 2,070
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Post by jkarr on Aug 27, 2014 7:27:59 GMT -5
wait ur saying u get a defense penalty when dwielding at novice and apprentice vs using one weapon in ur primary? is this just educated guess on ur part or what Feel free to build a log analyzer for yourself. Thank you for reminding me why I shouldn't try to answer these. glad to help and no prob, weve had a few other supersensitive types that liked to confuse basic source inquiries with direct attacks, so dont feel like ur the first
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Post by lyse on Aug 27, 2014 7:39:41 GMT -5
I just want to know what a log analyzer is
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 7:40:05 GMT -5
Feel free to build a log analyzer for yourself. Thank you for reminding me why I shouldn't try to answer these. glad to help and no prob, weve had a few other supersensitive types that liked to confuse basic source inquiries with direct attacks, so dont feel like ur the first Instead, lets try the fact that you are abrasive. If you are are going to be too lazy to do your own research, don't be an ass when someone tries to help you.
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jkarr
GDB Superstar
Posts: 2,070
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Post by jkarr on Aug 27, 2014 7:44:38 GMT -5
glad to help and no prob, weve had a few other supersensitive types that liked to confuse basic source inquiries with direct attacks, so dont feel like ur the first Instead, lets try the fact that you are abrasive. If you are are going to be too lazy to do your own research, don't be an ass when someone tries to help you. lol see thats what im talking about a simple question about where ur getting ur info from is 'abrasive' lol like i said ur not the only one of those here. 'it just from my conclusion as a player based on analyzing my logs' explains it well
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 7:45:01 GMT -5
I just want to know what a log analyzer is Whether you use triggers in your mud client or something like regex pattern matching on a log of your play, you can produce sets of data per fight on hit, miss, parry, block, and damage rates. From there, direct dump to a database table or manual copy and paste to a spreadsheet gets you most of the way to trend analysis.
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Post by jcarter on Aug 27, 2014 10:05:34 GMT -5
I just want to know what a log analyzer is back in the old days of games like everquest, the only numbers you ever saw were your damage and I think the damage other people did. people didn't even know the HP of monsters or bosses, much less things like DPS and how much stats effected it. so they wrote log analyzers, which would take the combat logs and statistically analyze them to figure out the data. people still do it with MMOs today to figure out the impact that stats have on arm intentionally hides numbers the best that it can. this leads to players basically being in the dark for how much stats impact the damage they do, being able to compare weapons, which fighting style does the most DPS, etc. the only sure way of being able to do it would pretty much just be sparring with your buddy and correlating the data from the two logs. hence the need for a log analyzer. even if that was developed though, it would still be reliant on some guesswork due to the constant increase of skills and random nature of mob stats.
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Post by lyse on Aug 27, 2014 11:53:22 GMT -5
I just want to know what a log analyzer is back in the old days of games like everquest, the only numbers you ever saw were your damage and I think the damage other people did. people didn't even know the HP of monsters or bosses, much less things like DPS and how much stats effected it. so they wrote log analyzers, which would take the combat logs and statistically analyze them to figure out the data. people still do it with MMOs today to figure out the impact that stats have on arm intentionally hides numbers the best that it can. this leads to players basically being in the dark for how much stats impact the damage they do, being able to compare weapons, which fighting style does the most DPS, etc. the only sure way of being able to do it would pretty much just be sparring with your buddy and correlating the data from the two logs. hence the need for a log analyzer. even if that was developed though, it would still be reliant on some guesswork due to the constant increase of skills and random nature of mob stats. I see, I got it now. I don't know if I would go that far to enjoy the game; I kind of like the idea that mobs have random stats and that a tembo could be a sooper-tembo and kick my ass. I also like that we can't agree on how the code works most times and you have to take a lot of information with a grain of salt.
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Post by jcarter on Aug 27, 2014 13:01:02 GMT -5
back in the old days of games like everquest, the only numbers you ever saw were your damage and I think the damage other people did. people didn't even know the HP of monsters or bosses, much less things like DPS and how much stats effected it. so they wrote log analyzers, which would take the combat logs and statistically analyze them to figure out the data. people still do it with MMOs today to figure out the impact that stats have on arm intentionally hides numbers the best that it can. this leads to players basically being in the dark for how much stats impact the damage they do, being able to compare weapons, which fighting style does the most DPS, etc. the only sure way of being able to do it would pretty much just be sparring with your buddy and correlating the data from the two logs. hence the need for a log analyzer. even if that was developed though, it would still be reliant on some guesswork due to the constant increase of skills and random nature of mob stats. I see, I got it now. I don't know if I would go that far to enjoy the game; I kind of like the idea that mobs have random stats and that a tembo could be a sooper-tembo and kick my ass. I also like that we can't agree on how the code works most times and you have to take a lot of information with a grain of salt. I don't think anyone actually has, although conceptually I don't think it would take more than a few hours at most to code. The information is going to be somewhat accurate, but again it depends on the control you're using. You can't just spar against your buddy and compare logs from day 1 with day 14 because too many variables have changed - your offense/defense, weapon skill, parry skill, and your buddy's as well. The only people who would be able to run these tests would be imms that could manually set all the variables the same. I guess you could argue that it's 'close enough' since we're not really trying to publish a journal article and show that yes, 2handed does more dps than dual wield and it is statistically significant with a p value of <.05. idk, it'd be an interesting exercise though. edit: In addition to above I'd be a little surprised/disappointed if staff (read: Morgenes) didn't have programs or scripts set up for that since it would be fundamentally necessary to setting up a somewhat balanced combat system.
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Post by demonspongecake on Aug 27, 2014 13:11:57 GMT -5
Does Bash even deal any kind of damage at all? It puts a heavy delay on you and makes you prone, so for awhile you cant move, flee, cast, or do anything, and are in a very vulnerable position. In many early life occurrences, getting bashed = almost certain death. But Bash itself does not damage hp. Not entirely accurate. The person is at a disadvantage yes. But using say a fast character I am able to still attack, dodge, parry and block. Which is why bash is usually followed by a disarm. Then it makes it very dangerous. Soon as they stand, Kick. I suggest only bashing while you have 90% of your HP or more. Even though it's from fucking ages ago it's worth saying bash does damage, but if you want to do 10+ damage you need to be an ankheg or something. Normal size humanoids do barely grazing/nick damage, and even half giants don't do much if I recall. Also having fairly serious parry/defense protects a lot from the disadvantages of being prone, so decent warriors/rangers only have to worry if they're seriously outclassed by the bashing warrior.
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Lizzie
Clueless newb
Posts: 199
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Post by Lizzie on Aug 27, 2014 15:41:41 GMT -5
I see, I got it now. I don't know if I would go that far to enjoy the game; I kind of like the idea that mobs have random stats and that a tembo could be a sooper-tembo and kick my ass. I also like that we can't agree on how the code works most times and you have to take a lot of information with a grain of salt. I don't think anyone actually has, although conceptually I don't think it would take more than a few hours at most to code. The information is going to be somewhat accurate, but again it depends on the control you're using. You can't just spar against your buddy and compare logs from day 1 with day 14 because too many variables have changed - your offense/defense, weapon skill, parry skill, and your buddy's as well. The only people who would be able to run these tests would be imms that could manually set all the variables the same. I guess you could argue that it's 'close enough' since we're not really trying to publish a journal article and show that yes, 2handed does more dps than dual wield and it is statistically significant with a p value of <.05. idk, it'd be an interesting exercise though. edit: In addition to above I'd be a little surprised/disappointed if staff (read: Morgenes) didn't have programs or scripts set up for that since it would be fundamentally necessary to setting up a somewhat balanced combat system. Experience with RPIs says you're going to be disappointed. Balance doesn't matter, especially if the players can't see the difference anyways.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 21:49:51 GMT -5
I don't think anyone actually has, although conceptually I don't think it would take more than a few hours at most to code. The information is going to be somewhat accurate, but again it depends on the control you're using. You can't just spar against your buddy and compare logs from day 1 with day 14 because too many variables have changed - your offense/defense, weapon skill, parry skill, and your buddy's as well. The only people who would be able to run these tests would be imms that could manually set all the variables the same. I guess you could argue that it's 'close enough' since we're not really trying to publish a journal article and show that yes, 2handed does more dps than dual wield and it is statistically significant with a p value of <.05. idk, it'd be an interesting exercise though. edit: In addition to above I'd be a little surprised/disappointed if staff (read: Morgenes) didn't have programs or scripts set up for that since it would be fundamentally necessary to setting up a somewhat balanced combat system. After two hours writing the analyzer, it took me data from about fifteen warriors, ten rangers, six assassins, and such, about 80% of which were my characters. Once you establish some base parameters, variables like wisdom and weapon quality fall out pretty quickly. All told, it was over 3 years of analysis, but I wasnt that serious about it.
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Post by latrineswimmer on Aug 28, 2014 1:11:19 GMT -5
Respectfully, half giants commonly do around 20hp on a bash against a human size target. Often it seems exactly 20hp. Tested many times recently.
I believe it is a hard cap, as bashing a mek does 20 damage too.
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dorksun
staff puppet account
Posts: 42
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Post by dorksun on Nov 7, 2014 11:13:54 GMT -5
christ its such a relief to find a place that offers transparent discussion of game mechanics instead of finger wagging
what around allanak can be foraged and sold for survival money? and where should i look to go to forage it, and where to sell it?
how much does a full salt sack sell for, and how much does it take to fill em up?
is there any way to tell if an equipment offers a movement points boost without buying and wearing it? like in the "view" command? are good things like that only sold by pcs?
is there a way to get all the info the view command offers in shops, but used on stuff thats just in your inventory or in the world?
are scrabs much tougher than scorpions? spiders and gith seem like tough customers, so i know to keep away from them at least.
should i buy a knife that actually says "skinning knife" in its name to skin things with, or will any "you can skin things with this" knife have the same chance?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 7, 2014 11:41:37 GMT -5
Mostly just salt. You can forage spice around Red Storm, but don't bring it back to Allanak if you don't know what you're doing. There might be a couple of places to forage "artifacts" (apparent trash that's somehow used as magick components) but I can't remember anymore, and they're a bit tricky to sell.
You can also pick bimbal (green sap-filled leaves) from certain plants around Allanak. These will sell for 18+ each at the herbalist, and she seems to clear her inventory of them every dawn. There should still be a bimbal plant just northwest of the west gates.
If you're really desperate, some types of rocks will sell for like one or two 'sid at the rock shop on Miner's Road. If you're able to forage food (it used to be that only rangers and subguild-scavengers could do this; no idea if this is still the case) then foraged food can also be sold at the grocer for small change.
A much easier and more lucrative "job" is to dress in shitty clothes and go around the Labyrinth a bit to collect stuff from dead NPCs and sell it. Their clothes and weapons are worth surprisingly decent money and the NPCs will continuously kill eachother.
I don't think there's a way to tell. However, plenty of movement-boosting gear (usually sandcloth-based) is sold by NPCs around the world, particularly in Luir's. It tends to offer poor protection, though. It's not that great unless you're a city-elf trying to do shit in the desert, which is a bad idea altogether. If you're a human, just wear armor and depend on your mount for movement. It's not worth going out of your way to get +mv gear.
Can't recall if it gives the exact same information as view, but 'assess' (and 'assess -v' for more details; no idea what the -v stands for) gives some feedback that usually isn't readily apparent elsewhere. You can also assess people.
Most scrab are sort of medium difficulty. They can hit kinda hard, but they don't fight so well. They're some of the easiest animals in the southlands, but that's not saying much.
You can skin with pretty much any kind of knife/dagger, as well as axes. Skinning knives typically have a slight bonus to the skill check, but it never seemed significant to me. I've had characters that would skin with longknives and hand axes without any trouble.
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Post by lyse on Nov 7, 2014 14:46:15 GMT -5
christ its such a relief to find a place that offers transparent discussion of game mechanics instead of finger wagging what around allanak can be foraged and sold for survival money? and where should i look to go to forage it, and where to sell it? how much does a full salt sack sell for, and how much does it take to fill em up? is there any way to tell if an equipment offers a movement points boost without buying and wearing it? like in the "view" command? are good things like that only sold by pcs? is there a way to get all the info the view command offers in shops, but used on stuff thats just in your inventory or in the world? are scrabs much tougher than scorpions? spiders and gith seem like tough customers, so i know to keep away from them at least. should i buy a knife that actually says "skinning knife" in its name to skin things with, or will any "you can skin things with this" knife have the same chance? Outside of the basic beginning grind, money doesn't really do anything and if you get in a clan, you pretty much don't need it. That being said: you can also be a pooper scooper for money. The salt in the salt flats....the purple ones are worth the most and you can sell them at the six arm cleaner. The other ones you can sell at the salt yard. You should definitely be doing something else besides grebbing while you're out there. Try to bump into a scrab to spar, but if you have low endurance you might want to stick to joZhal. Gear: basic sand cloth stuff gives a few movement points per piece. But you shouldn't be worried about movement points because you're going outside with a mount right? Some things you can get an idea of the bonus it gives from it's desc. But really, once you have your head, neck, body and wrists covered, try not to worry about gear because early game you're very squishy for the mobs outside allanak. Scrabs vs scorpions: if you don't have blood burn tablets, scorpions are more dangerous cause poison. I've seen blood burn kill people who weren't prepared. So keep in mind if they hit you there's a chance you'll get poisoned. Hope that helps some.
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