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Post by bigballa on Aug 16, 2019 21:19:51 GMT -5
I thoroughly enjoyed my scenes with Mordhu and Greedy One, sad to see you go.
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seuly
Clueless newb
Posts: 103
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Post by seuly on Aug 17, 2019 3:45:11 GMT -5
G.O. was the O.G. of elves. RIP.
Two Moons is Shaloonsh’s attempt to repeat the Bejeweled Hand.
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Post by shakes on Aug 17, 2019 11:55:16 GMT -5
I don't know what he's attempting. Many of the little hand signs and greetings and such were my own development. They weren't in the clan docs so I adopted some Choctaw stuff to the desert elf side that I'd picked up from my Oklahoma kinfolk. The Two Moons always seemed to me to be part Comanchero with their foot in both worlds ... the city and the tribal life.
They accused me of "ruining" the Two Moons with Greedy One there at the end. But I'd felt that I'd made it relevant and memorable.
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faroukel
Displaced Tuluki
What's a story without a villain?
Posts: 201
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Post by faroukel on Aug 21, 2019 8:11:09 GMT -5
Butcher Brons Gentleman Gog Greedy One Ventus the Vile Grud the cannibal mutant Mordhu the green dwarf who started the 'rangers' White, the albino swordsman out of Red Storm The Beast of Red Storm, the tusked mutant Rukkian Reading these makes me wanna RP with you. Roll a HL Navehan.
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Post by explayer on Aug 31, 2019 16:56:20 GMT -5
I'm done too.
Someone summed it up pretty well somewhere on this site. You spend 95% or more of your time trying to find that moment of fun. The payoff just isn't worth it.
In my particular case, more like 100% of the time. Grinding for six weeks to try to become strong enough to reach a certain place in the wilderness and achieve a magick-related goal, only to have the character perish to someone's single typed command so that they could have two minutes of excitement. With no means to defend against it (save perhaps never leaving the city at all).
Before that, grinding for eight weeks with a miraculous sparring partner, only to realize that even having a close to maximum weapons skill doesn't help all that much. Those apprentices and journeymen will still strike you (and not only through criticals). Seems they've coded in some hole to shield use and parry lately so that no one is a fortress anymore. Which means all that matters is numbers now, more or less. You need to be a part of the bigger group. That's what the game is reduced to. If you want to survive, you need to be a part of the bigger group. You might as well be faceless.
Not to mention I made the mistake of creating a female character that time (inspired by a song and an image, of all things). Hit on relentlessly for weeks until suddenly it all stopped (probably got doxxed and people spread the word OOCly). Bleah.
Before that, grinding for eight weeks and joining a Merchant House, only to find it utterly lifeless. Maybe the top guy was busy doing things, but the peons got maybe three minutes of action a RL day, if that, and were let in on nothing.
Before that.. well, I hope you see the pattern here.
Speaking of weapons skills, the whole progression business is just another mark of the malaise lying upon the staff. Why did they set it up so that most people will never surpass journeyman? Basically so they can kill PCs using NPCs without having to break a sweat. It was just another way for them to do less work. Brokkr more or less openly admitted it on the GDB.
And the lack of things to do. It's so mind-numbing. It's like they've done all they can to suck any enjoyment out of the game for anyone except PKers and social types and PKers disguised as social types. (PKers only of unimportant PCs though, don't touch one of the precious sponsored roles because that means the staff would have to do some work again). No one can find something special, no one can stand out except the sponsored leaders. Gotta maintain the stale old status quo with the stale old GMHs and noble houses.
I could rant for pages about this, but what's the use. A lot of it's already been said on these forums anyhow.
So, I'm done. All of that time spent. It's depressing to think about, but now the monkey is off my back.
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Post by explayer on Aug 31, 2019 17:59:09 GMT -5
Reading shakes' initial post in this thread and some subsequent posts leads me to ask: why don't they actively interview the player requesting a karma review? Why not bring him or her into an OOC room and give the player a chance to respond to the points they're making, and have some back and forth?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2019 18:06:52 GMT -5
Reading shakes' initial post in this thread and some subsequent posts leads me to ask: why don't they actively interview the player requesting a karma review? Why not bring him or her into an OOC room and give the player a chance to respond to the points they're making, and have some back and forth? Call it an hour of prep, scheduling, missed meetings, admin review and debrief per 20 min interview. Multiply by the playerbase per sixmonths or year. If an extra 300-800 hours were going to be spent on the game a year, we can probably come up with more impactful ways.
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punished ppurg
GDB Superstar
Why are we still here? Just to suffer?
Posts: 1,098
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Post by punished ppurg on Aug 31, 2019 18:08:31 GMT -5
Why don't they actively interview the player requesting a karma review? Woah there, buddy. You expect our precious unpaid volunteers to waste their minimal staffing hours by talking with players on how to improve? The elusive carrot of karma for me but not for thee is the only thing that keeps some of these oldbies logging in.
By the way, welcome to the club.
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Post by pinkerdlu on Aug 31, 2019 18:10:17 GMT -5
Reading shakes' initial post in this thread and some subsequent posts leads me to ask: why don't they actively interview the player requesting a karma review? Why not bring him or her into an OOC room and give the player a chance to respond to the points they're making, and have some back and forth? Call it an hour of prep, scheduling, missed meetings, admin review and debrief per 20 min interview. Multiply by the playerbase per sixmonths or year. If an extra 300-800 hours were going to be spent on the game a year, we can probably come up with more impactful ways.
Lol what a garbage fucking post.
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Post by shakes on Aug 31, 2019 19:46:32 GMT -5
In my case, that personal discussion wouldn't have helped much.
In my rebuttal to it in the request I pointed out, why, if I was off track, didn't they offer me some guidance prior to waiting until the end of the year to simply deny me?
But the rub of it is this: To gain achievement you must play X style. I don't like X style. I like Y style. I have to choose between karma, sponsored roles, staff love ... and my enjoyment.
A discussion wouldn't have helped. What are they going to do? Change their mind and decide they approve of my playstyle?
I've gotten back into the game since quitting (this is twice now I've 'quit' ... probably will be a third or fourth time too) and set my expectations to "twink alone in the wilderness when you want." But that turns out to be not really all that much fun. I don't know how to get past that fatal flaw. It could have sustained my interest early on but not now that I feel I've done and seen everything you can do alone without a bigger goal.
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mehtastic
GDB Superstar
Armers Anonymous sponsor
Posts: 1,699
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Post by mehtastic on Sept 1, 2019 7:08:36 GMT -5
Reading shakes' initial post in this thread and some subsequent posts leads me to ask: why don't they actively interview the player requesting a karma review? Why not bring him or her into an OOC room and give the player a chance to respond to the points they're making, and have some back and forth? Call it an hour of prep, scheduling, missed meetings, admin review and debrief per 20 min interview. Multiply by the playerbase per sixmonths or year. If an extra 300-800 hours were going to be spent on the game a year, we can probably come up with more impactful ways.
"But it would take time" is a nonsensical argument. And it gets thrown around a lot whenever people on the GDB suggest something staff should be doing. Nyr's "we're volunteers" defense is derived from this argument. The staff volunteered to spend their time on the betterment of the game. Full stop. If multiple players are suggesting that a particular staff effort would improve the extremely poor player-staff relationship in Armageddon, then you'd think the staff, whose purpose is to volunteer time towards the betterment of the game, would consider it. Staff and players mutually benefit from a good relationship between both parties. The problem is that players have been conditioned to accept the occasional staff meeting, sponsored role call, and character report response as "good enough", when in reality, that feeling blockades actual dialogues. And staff are happy with that contentment, because it means less work for them. Currently, if you want to have a one-on-one live talk to a member of a 14-person staff body presiding over a game with about 200 players, you have to submit a ticket and hope that they decide to schedule something with you. There is, as far as I know, no policy for staff to follow when a player requests a meeting at Denny's. In fact, OOC rooms where players and staff can talk exist for two purposes, primarily: punishing players (or rather, explaining to players the punishment they're about to receive) and interviewing prospective staff members, keeping the cycle of the bad player-staff relationship going endlessly. There is no justification for that level of bureaucracy. There is no other game of roughly equivalent size with a staff body as large as Armageddon's that comes to mind, and there is no other game of roughly equivalent size that handles its players this way.
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mehtastic
GDB Superstar
Armers Anonymous sponsor
Posts: 1,699
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Post by mehtastic on Sept 1, 2019 7:14:10 GMT -5
Not to mention I made the mistake of creating a female character that time (inspired by a song and an image, of all things). Hit on relentlessly for weeks until suddenly it all stopped (probably got doxxed and people spread the word OOCly). Bleah. That sounds horrifying. I know there are some pretty thirsty dudes playing (and even staffing) Arm but I didn't realize how bad it actually was. That being said, I never actually created a female character on Arm, so I only really observed this behavior from afar. Good luck to you wherever you end up playing next.
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tedium
Clueless newb
Posts: 164
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Post by tedium on Sept 1, 2019 9:05:20 GMT -5
(threadjack) A lot of the time, the more that you say no the more that they'll pursue. It's not even about you but about having something they can't get. The trick is to look just needy enough that nobody bothers you about it, but not so needy that you get a reputation. Excluding my dwarves, the big-chested chars I play get seriously pursued less than others, and I can only assume that it's because people assume they're open for business. The worst sexual harassment I've had was on my massive, Brienne-esque, one-eyed arm soldier who was meant to be very nonsexual. There was a mage player who would pose erotic S&M-like stuff during subdues, and the templar PC I was subduing them for would go along with it. I don't mean that the person being arrested ACCUSED my PC of those things, I mean that they would pose moaning, getting their hair pulled by my char, or arching their back while getting pinned to the wall. Stuff like that. It made that character feel like she throwing people into the Jail House Rock prison instead of Guantanamo Bay. (/threadjack) Back on the topic of staff hours, I think that's a really poor excuse. Armageddon has significantly more staff than other MUs and accomplishes significantly less. This is with a good deal of it being automated as a MUD instead of a MUSH. I mean, if you're a PC in Arm, you just buy a gear item that has a hold-out dagger and put the dagger inside. In a MU* you have to make rolls about availability and concealment in your job, which lets staff know that you have the weapon concealed at X skill on your person. Then you have to make a note that gets approved by another staffer, so that if something happens the storyteller knows you're not pulling anything out of your ass. Lots of things are the same way. Armageddon doesn't have any of that red tape and busywork but staff still manage to accomplish significantly less. Not to mention that Armageddon has a one-character policy that other MUs lack.
I'm not saying that Arm staff don't put in the hours. It's entirely possible (and probable) that the sheer amount of stuff that isn't automated on MUSHes means that staff have created very efficient ways to handle requests, and leave much more in the hands of players. I think that Arm staff could do to leave more in the hands of players. Something like Karma Review, which cannot be automated, is rare and important enough to players that it's worth taking time to sit down and discuss things. Honestly, I don't think that an interview would be productive in the sense of allow players to defend themselves or justify their actions at all. Staff are too bullheaded to be convinced that they might have been wrong. But I do think staff approach karma with a one-size-fits-all mentality that requires players to do things they find extremely unfun, and an interview would allow for an exchange that might remedy that. Players have strengths and staff should be aware of that and encourage those strengths. There's also the issue of staff awarding karma for blowing smoke up their ass, and I think that an interview might help to cut through some of that nonsense by giving players tangible things to work on, but maybe not.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 9:50:27 GMT -5
Call it an hour of prep, scheduling, missed meetings, admin review and debrief per 20 min interview. Multiply by the playerbase per sixmonths or year. If an extra 300-800 hours were going to be spent on the game a year, we can probably come up with more impactful ways.
"But it would take time" is a nonsensical argument. And it gets thrown around a lot whenever people on the GDB suggest something staff should be doing. Nyr's "we're volunteers" defense is derived from this argument. The staff volunteered to spend their time on the betterment of the game. Full stop. If multiple players are suggesting that a particular staff effort would improve the extremely poor player-staff relationship in Armageddon, then you'd think the staff, whose purpose is to volunteer time towards the betterment of the game, would consider it. Staff and players mutually benefit from a good relationship between both parties. The problem is that players have been conditioned to accept the occasional staff meeting, sponsored role call, and character report response as "good enough", when in reality, that feeling blockades actual dialogues. And staff are happy with that contentment, because it means less work for them. Currently, if you want to have a one-on-one live talk to a member of a 14-person staff body presiding over a game with about 200 players, you have to submit a ticket and hope that they decide to schedule something with you. There is, as far as I know, no policy for staff to follow when a player requests a meeting at Denny's. In fact, OOC rooms where players and staff can talk exist for two purposes, primarily: punishing players (or rather, explaining to players the punishment they're about to receive) and interviewing prospective staff members, keeping the cycle of the bad player-staff relationship going endlessly. There is no justification for that level of bureaucracy. There is no other game of roughly equivalent size with a staff body as large as Armageddon's that comes to mind, and there is no other game of roughly equivalent size that handles its players this way. None of which I said or argued. Calm down.
All I said was that I'd rather have have 500 hours of new content to play. Maybe a pick and choose skill system for custom classes a subguilds. Or 80 additional hours of rpts.
I no longer think I can convince staff I'm right. Lets just get past that to a solution or three.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 12:20:41 GMT -5
(threadjack) The worst sexual harassment I've had was on my massive, Brienne-esque, one-eyed arm soldier who was meant to be very nonsexual. There was a mage player who would pose erotic S&M-like stuff during subdues, and the templar PC I was subduing them for would go along with it. I don't mean that the person being arrested ACCUSED my PC of those things, I mean that they would pose moaning, getting their hair pulled by my char, or arching their back while getting pinned to the wall. Stuff like that. It made that character feel like she throwing people into the Jail House Rock prison instead of Guantanamo Bay. (/threadjack) And this seriously bothered you? Why would you consider this S&M? I might be not getting it, because you're just taking a bit of that emote out for example, while the full emote was a lot more S&M then that. But the examples you're giving are pretty innocent? I mean you're subduing the person. You think there is no hair pulling and wall pinning? How do you imagine subduing truly happens? I can see an argument that instead of emoting this, they should've let 'you' emote it out, because you're the one doing the act. I do not know the situation. But if you subdued and didn't emote how at all, well then … I would say it's fair play. Again, maybe their full emote was a lot more sexualized in nature, but the examples you gave are pretty benign and just trying to set up a scene. I got no arguments about the whole "Why don't Staff interview people over karma grants, instead of doing a request resolution." I personally think it's a great idea. There used to be a time when the numbers of people involved was too great to do that. That time has passed.
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