bmj2
Clueless newb
Posts: 81
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Post by bmj2 on Mar 27, 2013 14:43:55 GMT -5
Tuluk at present, is only super wealthy long-lived characters (tavern-sitters), bards, and noobs (dropping link everywhere), and a couple militia
Allanak is only magickers, rinthis, and assholes, and a couple militia.
Luirs is only nomads and Kuracis (the militia).
Between them all travel the twink-rangers/warriors that have no concept of world-traveling being OOC (geared out in such extravagance its ridiculous).
At least a month ago there was more players in the Byn then the active game populations of the two cities combined. Seeing 18 byn in Luirs made me sad that its hard to get 3 active players where I play.
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blargle
Clueless newb
Beast Master
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Post by blargle on Mar 27, 2013 14:55:33 GMT -5
"Between them all travel the twink-rangers/warriors that have no concept of world-traveling being OOC (geared out in such extravagance its ridiculous)."
Care to elaborate? What is OOC about traveling from say red storm to allanak on to luirs and then to tuluk? Or the other way around?
Also what is wrong with character's having nice gear (what do you consider extravagant)?
I understand that ooc outdoor "rooms" should be pretty big, conceptually. However travel is relatively easy. If they really wanted to represent a large scale they should either increase the number of outdoor rooms between hotspots, or drastically increase the stamina drain of traveling through the already existing rooms.
I don't know if I'd hold it against the players who do travel the world because the way the game is built does not seem to discourage such behavior.
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bmj2
Clueless newb
Posts: 81
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Post by bmj2 on Mar 27, 2013 15:04:56 GMT -5
Its supposed to be far, arduous, slow. The staff have said, numerous times, that just because you can codedly walk the known world in an hour, doesn't mean that its IC appropriate. They don't want to add numerous blank and empty rooms just to discourage player behavior.
The game is built to be very easy, and thats why its taken advantage of. Its meant to be played in, not just done because its possible.
Extravagent gear is full-sets of plate/chain/chitin/whatever, ivory and ruby weapons, etc etc. Look at any of the current world-crossers, and you'll see.
People say that indy merchants are rich...
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bmj2
Clueless newb
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Post by bmj2 on Mar 27, 2013 15:15:07 GMT -5
Also what is wrong with character's having nice gear (what do you consider extravagant)? Nothing necessarily wrong with it, but an outdoorsman shouldn't be wearing 4000 sid worth of heavy armor. It generally means they are a twink, because they are dressed like a plate-covered knight in the hot desert. Its unrealistic. But yeah, its the way it is. I don't know if I'd hold it against the players who do travel the world because the way the game is built does not seem to discourage such behavior. Yeah the game is designed so you can do alot of things, you can pretend that when you were nearly killed one day that after a good sleep you are right as rain (because the game doesn't have lingering injuries) - you dont have to emote, the game doesn't require it, etc etc. The list is long. But at the end of the day its a role-playing game, you are meant to role-play characters, to some degree of realism (obviously not completely real). Just doing whatever the game world allows, is, as I said, twinkish. |
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Post by jimmyhoffa on Mar 27, 2013 15:19:33 GMT -5
The staff have said, numerous times, that just because you can codedly walk the known world in an hour, doesn't mean that its IC appropriate. lol if it can be done people will do it. if staf wants less people travelling so easily they should do something about it. the world was amazing when the road north of luir's was blocked, whoever decided to clear it again was a moron. should kept that way blocked cause there was 2 ways to travel between the north and south, red desert or the pah which made travelling long and dangerous. |
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bmj2
Clueless newb
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Post by bmj2 on Mar 27, 2013 15:29:22 GMT -5
thats the problem with the game, its not the staff for not making the world bigger, but the players for doing anything and everything "because they can". You could make the most advanced, large-scale and elaborate world and the twink/powergamers would find the fastest, most efficient way to abuse it as the first point of order.
The game world, as it is, is big ENOUGH and dangerous ENOUGH to discourage ENOUGH of the pbase to do the right thing. Thats why I said, in my original post a few back, that the world-crossing warriors in full-suits of unrealistic armor with weapons made of the finest materials are twinks, because they do what they CAN in terms of the code, instead of what their character SHOULD in terms of the world.
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Post by succulentgroin on Mar 27, 2013 15:45:47 GMT -5
thats the problem with the game, its not the staff for not making the world bigger, but the players for doing anything and everything "because they can". You could make the most advanced, large-scale and elaborate world and the twink/powergamers would find the fastest, most efficient way to abuse it as the first point of order. The game world, as it is, is big ENOUGH and dangerous ENOUGH to discourage ENOUGH of the pbase to do the right thing. Thats why I said, in my original post a few back, that the world-crossing warriors in full-suits of unrealistic armor with weapons made of the finest materials are twinks, because they do what they CAN in terms of the code, instead of what their character SHOULD in terms of the world. Although I may agree with some of this, there's nothing dangerous about the world anymore. Within a few days of playtime you can take most of the horrors out in the waste and can make a fair bit of coin in very little time. It may be unrealistic for a human in our world to wear a full suit of armor in the Sahara but zalanthan humans aren't us. If you really think some of what players do is unrealistic or twinkish be an example and complain ic. Honestly think its more of a mixture of both. I occasionally see some believable folks cruising around but all of those in power seem to be the same, long lived, twinkish folks. Which in turn will drive some newer players into committing the same acts in hopes of surpassing or being more like so and so. I think staff and players aren't doing things right and seriously doubt there's gonna be any drastic change in the quality of rp from arms players. |
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Post by jcarter on Mar 27, 2013 16:36:02 GMT -5
The staff have said, numerous times, that just because you can codedly walk the known world in an hour, doesn't mean that its IC appropriate. lol if it can be done people will do it. if staf wants less people travelling so easily they should do something about it. the world was amazing when the road north of luir's was blocked, whoever decided to clear it again was a moron. should kept that way blocked cause there was 2 ways to travel between the north and south, red desert or the pah which made travelling long and dangerous. i agree with this. players shouldn't have to go digging through offhand comments on the gdb to be able to "correctly" travel the world at the proper speed staff want. either increase the number of rooms, increase the delay for travelling from one room to another (while leaving other commands unlagged i.e. dismounting), or whatever. there's many, many ways in which the staff could codedly change this, but instead that's too much work for the team of people who pissed away 3+ years of effort on ideas, code, and locations for a failed sequel. The whole point of using a MUD codebase as background is to prevent bullshit like that because you have an easily modifiable code to enforce rules and policies. It's dumb to shift the burden of playing it out onto the entire playerbase when someone can spend a small amount of time hammering out a permanent system that can enforce the desired environment. |
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blargle
Clueless newb
Beast Master
Posts: 63
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Post by blargle on Mar 27, 2013 16:43:07 GMT -5
This is a good point. What about fantasy races? What about a dwarf or a half giant or something who have supernatural levels of strength and endurance? You still think it is unrealistic for them to walk around wearing armor in a desert?
I've also seen arguments that the materials that armor is made from typically comes from the wildlife and it could be that they have adapted in such a way that their shell/hides etc deal with the sun/heat in ways that would not make it unfeasible to use it in that fashion.
Frankly, though I am not currently playing a globetrotter (and I never really have, though I've considered doing a ranger explorer), I wouldn't mind if they did add in a heavier stamina drain for travel, I'd adapt and plan accordingly if I did choose to travel somewhere.
If the staff made the call that it was absolutely dumb and unrealistic for characters to wear certain types of armor outside of certain areas, well then I'd be totally for them adding in some coded method of making it a detriment. Make people require many times as much water. Make the stamina drain multiply. Code in heat stroke.
Do something codedly to demonstrate to the players what they are doing is unrealistic and I think the players would adapt and behave accordingly. If people just start carrying much much more water, shit, make water weigh more.
Ultimately it is the staff who makes the calls on these issues and until they actually do something to enforce whatever their stance on the issues are, players will continue to knowingly or unknowingly cross the line.
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Post by HidingBoots on Mar 27, 2013 17:39:37 GMT -5
"think staff and players aren't doing things right and seriously doubt there's gonna be any drastic change in the quality of rp from arms players."
I agree... Although, I also want to throw something else out there. The RP that I've seen in arm is much, much better than in other games I've played. Anytime I hear anything about an Iron Realm mud having good RP I just want to smack their head and say 'Doh!'. I can't speak about Shadows of Isildur much, but the very little I did see seemed extremely ditsy and borderline OOC.
The distance between the different cities surprised me when I mapped it out. My first ten or so characters all lived in Allanak, and I assumed that other cities were very far away. That's the impression I got. But it is indeed quite easy to travel between them. I like the idea of making more rooms not only because it would make the game less twink'ish, but because it would make travelling a more worthy endeavor. I want to have to sit down and plan out everything I'll need for the voyage with my companions, and make a day out of it instead of just waiting for the leader to execute their movement list.
There are already movement point bonuses for wearing attire which is suited for traveling. I guess it doesn't make much of a difference for those mounted characters, but IRL it wouldn't make such a difference for them either.
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Post by jcarter on Mar 27, 2013 18:04:06 GMT -5
If the staff made the call that it was absolutely dumb and unrealistic for characters to wear certain types of armor outside of certain areas, well then I'd be totally for them adding in some coded method of making it a detriment. Make people require many times as much water. Make the stamina drain multiply. Code in heat stroke. Do something codedly to demonstrate to the players what they are doing is unrealistic and I think the players would adapt and behave accordingly. If people just start carrying much much more water, shit, make water weigh more. Ultimately it is the staff who makes the calls on these issues and until they actually do something to enforce whatever their stance on the issues are, players will continue to knowingly or unknowingly cross the line. This. The point of the code is to enforce the environment and make characters behave according to the immortal's view. There's this dissonance of staff wanting players to act accordingly yet refusing to lift a finger and put in coded support for these grey areas. |
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Post by HidingBoots on Mar 27, 2013 18:20:53 GMT -5
If the staff made the call that it was absolutely dumb and unrealistic for characters to wear certain types of armor outside of certain areas, well then I'd be totally for them adding in some coded method of making it a detriment. Make people require many times as much water. Make the stamina drain multiply. Code in heat stroke. Do something codedly to demonstrate to the players what they are doing is unrealistic and I think the players would adapt and behave accordingly. If people just start carrying much much more water, shit, make water weigh more. Ultimately it is the staff who makes the calls on these issues and until they actually do something to enforce whatever their stance on the issues are, players will continue to knowingly or unknowingly cross the line. This. The point of the code is to enforce the environment and make characters behave according to the immortal's view. There's this dissonance of staff wanting players to act accordingly yet refusing to lift a finger and put in coded support for these grey areas. Speaking of code... Anyone get that codebase from Delerak going? I'd love to try it out. |
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Post by jimmyhoffa on Mar 27, 2013 21:09:39 GMT -5
This. The point of the code is to enforce the environment and make characters behave according to the immortal's view. There's this dissonance of staff wanting players to act accordingly yet refusing to lift a finger and put in coded support for these grey areas. agreed with your last post and this one, it is just lazy to expect players to enforce themselves. if staff want something to change, its literally in their hands. would also be nice to see staff take a more active role as dungeon masters and storytellers and i dont care what delerak or anyone else says I miss the days of halaster who would work his ass off to do rpts and hrpts involving the players, building plots for the players |
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Post by nipwip on Mar 27, 2013 22:26:50 GMT -5
You can emote music and have it add to the game, easily.
Amidst the noise and rancor of the rancid tavern, Joe Bard strums at his guitar, plucking out a simple, jaunty tune.
The problem is there are too many pretentious assholes who want to make it overly technical, usually the same people using obscure and overly complicated words in their sdesc.
Don't sing, don't give me a paragraph to describe each little twitch of your finger on the banjo, just add to the ambiance of the setting. Being a bard doesn't mean you need to be the obnoxious center of attention or you need to be a generic quirky/witty/pun-spewing jackass, you can do amazing things to a scene without doing much at all.
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Post by HidingBoots on Mar 27, 2013 23:06:34 GMT -5
You can emote music and have it add to the game, easily. Amidst the noise and rancor of the rancid tavern, Joe Bard strums at his guitar, plucking out a simple, jaunty tune. The problem is there are too many pretentious assholes who want to make it overly technical, usually the same people using obscure and overly complicated words in their sdesc. Don't sing, don't give me a paragraph to describe each little twitch of your finger on the banjo, just add to the ambiance of the setting. Being a bard doesn't mean you need to be the obnoxious center of attention or you need to be a generic quirky/witty/pun-spewing jackass, you can do amazing things to a scene without doing much at all. Heh, I once saw an awfully big word in someones sdesc, looked it up, and found out that it can be 1 of two very distinct colors. |
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