punished ppurg
GDB Superstar
Why are we still here? Just to suffer?
Posts: 1,098 
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Post by punished ppurg on Nov 15, 2014 20:27:04 GMT -5
Gith interest me, they really do. Reading help gith implies that they have culture and lore behind them, but it is nowhere to be seen, and recent staff posts on the gdb suggest the same. Gith have a huge backstory from the source. Here's the wiki page.However, all of that is lost and Gith are just some sort of pseudo-goblin mindless griefer in the sands due to Arm's fear of being a Dark Sun game. I remember seeing a producer post saying there was no current Gith history or documentation going beyond help gith. It's pretty sad. |
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Post by nyrsucks on Nov 15, 2014 20:28:04 GMT -5
Muk Utep is like Muad'Dib with his prescience and the Golden Path. Spice is obviously Dune. If you look at a salt worm, they are obviously Dune. The name "Shield Wall" is from Dune.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 15, 2014 20:28:37 GMT -5
And you think just MAYBE Dark Sun might've gotten inspiration for their female mindbending templars from Dune, which predates the earliest MUD by around 25 years?
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delerak
GDB Superstar
PK'ed by jcarter
"When you want to fool the world, tell the truth." - Otto Von Bismarck
Posts: 1,670
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Post by delerak on Nov 15, 2014 20:30:35 GMT -5
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delerak
GDB Superstar
PK'ed by jcarter
"When you want to fool the world, tell the truth." - Otto Von Bismarck
Posts: 1,670
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Post by delerak on Nov 15, 2014 20:33:09 GMT -5
Dune doesn't have templars.. also Dark Sun takes most of its inspiration from ancient civilizations. Many of the city-states resemble something from our own history, see below: Balic - Rome/Greece Draj - Aztecs Gulg - African jungle tribes Raam - Egyptian pharaohs Urik - Babylon from: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Sun |
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Post by nyrsucks on Nov 15, 2014 20:36:46 GMT -5
I'm not saying that Arm isn't based on Dark Sun. I am saying is is also based partly on Dune. Also northern templars, taking their previous abilities combines have some similarities to the Bene Gesserit.
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Post by jcarter on Nov 15, 2014 20:53:40 GMT -5
And you think just MAYBE Dark Sun might've gotten inspiration for their female mindbending templars from Dune, which predates the earliest MUD by around 25 years? from my understanding (and browinsg the dune wiki) most bene gesserit abilities were grounded within a physical sort of basis, i.e. hypnotic suggestion by controlling their voice, lie detecting based off of reading people, and control over their body to alter metabolism and so on. that's a pretty far cry from a high fantasy telepathic powers and projecting yourself into the ethereal realm, not to mention how they were advisors vs. enforcerers and arbitrators of the law. unless there's some direct line from the creators of dark sun, it's really just stretching conjecture to the limit. i could argue that mindbending templars were inspired by jedi and the force but that certainly doesn't make it true. |
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dorksun
staff puppet account
Posts: 42
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Post by dorksun on Nov 15, 2014 21:04:12 GMT -5
the meks may be going extinct as well if things keep up. but maybe theyve realized the tremendous extent theyd need to overhaul things to fully camouflage the old darksun influence. muls for example are a big red flag, and the silt sea+skimmers, preserver/defilers, etc.
tolkienesque fantasy races arent owned by dnd and have been riffed remixed and ripped off so much that theyre actually one of the few things they could get away with(momentarily disregarding anyone going "oh your desert elves run good too huh" or etc) making this supposed extinction of halflings a little unnecessary
maybe the halflings are in hiding preparing for war against the silt giants, their natural ultimate nemesis
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Post by jcarter on Nov 15, 2014 21:28:27 GMT -5
there's really not much way to divorce yourself from dark sun when you have a game with 20 years of history featuring it, beyond complete retcons. halflings, kanks, and mantis are still a part of game lore and history, even if they're no longer actually implemented (not sure if mantis are IG still or not). i have no idea what the plan was to separate the game from dark sun, or why they even started by phasing out certain minor things. i mean seriously, there's dozens of obvious cross-overs that are indisputably part of the dark sun IP. there's no feasible way of changing the game to confidently say 'we are separated away from the dark sun IP' outside of having arm 2.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2014 7:22:09 GMT -5
jcarter, the bene gesserit had a ritual before death, in which they would share the thoughts, understandings, and memories of their soon-to-be predecessor. The Reverend Mother would then experience the Spice Agony and transform from a Sayyadina to the Reverend Mother. She knew everything all past bene gesserits knew, including all their ancestors.
Yes, spice was definitely involved, but spice was merely the catalyst. The power itself was innate. If they didn't have that natural power, they'd just end up being no better off than failed Guild Navigators. The Kurac Archives has (or had) shades of Suk School in its basis.
Also, a couple of the tribal "religious" beliefs embrace certain of the Dune concepts, which are loosely based on a mix of Zen Buddhism, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam.
I've never played Darksun but I've read every Dune book by Herbert and by his son and co-writer.
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Halflings
Nov 16, 2014 9:30:21 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by lyse on Nov 16, 2014 9:30:21 GMT -5
I get the elements of Dune in the game and loved the Dune series. But outside of a few elements Kurac= House Atreides, spice (although it is mostly treated like a drug IG), salt worms, etc Arm is basically a Darksun game. There's a reason house Kurac sticks out like a sore thumb and in a couple of ways it doesn't mesh with the game.
As far as Kanks, I think I left the game when they were just starting that plot. I could live with there being no Kanks. Although I miss kank honey, there's enough bugs in the game to actually not miss them.
The halfling thing....well that's different. While not entirely missable, they were the keepers of the forest and a life tree(?). Are life trees still a part of the game?
While it's not really that big of a deal. I feel like taking stuff like that out of the game just because they don't want to acknowledge Arm is basically a Darksun game is a little silly. Is WOTC even pursuing Arm like that? It's just....wow. Just add the legal disclaimer saying a Darksun game and be done with it.
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Post by gloryhound on Nov 16, 2014 14:13:08 GMT -5
I think one of the last sightings of a halfling went like this:
(background: Tuluk)
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The war-painted halfing arrives from the west.
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The war-painted halfing exclaims, in an unknown tongue:
"Djit sf lmxva ril gu ekd!
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The war-painted halfing runs east.
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The tall, muscular man says to the dirty, large-nosed man:
"What the feck does "Djit sf lmxva ril gu ekd!" mean?
>
A wall of water arrives from the west.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Halflings
Nov 16, 2014 14:15:48 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2014 14:15:48 GMT -5
I'd have been cool if kenku replaced the halflings.
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mood
Displaced Tuluki
JOHN DARNIELLE #1 FANZONE
Posts: 335
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Post by mood on Nov 16, 2014 21:26:26 GMT -5
halflings actually caused the flood that exterminated them; they opened a portal to vivadu iirc.
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Post by sirra on Nov 16, 2014 22:14:54 GMT -5
Is Sanvean long gone now? I feel that Arm suffered for the arbitrary removal of the unique elements of the Dark Sun source material. Let's bring back halflings and kanks, correct our previous mistakes. And by us I mean the producers. I agree. I've always thought that the game suffered from an ill-conceived attempt to monetize it. When as Arm II proved, they didn't really even have the fortitude or the drive to even flesh out a fully original setting. But it seems like they ended up with the worst of both. I always missed kanks, and even when it was like 20 game years after the last kank went extinct, my characters would still reflexively use words like 'kankshit'. As for the races...I never really thought the halflings or the mantis should be playable anyways. Halflings especially were just an even more obnoxiously isolated and reclusive iteration on the desert elves. The most bizarre thing is that LONG after the halflings closed, there were still 2-3 of them kicking around. I guess doing a lot of solo RP. The mantis...fuck em. Maybe two people on the game could even RP them correctly. The only race which I thought had staying power was the gith, which were both true antagonists, and quite out there and interacting with the world and having an impact on it by their choices. The Red Fangs really would have been better gith than d-elves. |
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