Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2015 18:51:27 GMT -5
Keep in mind, if you are overencumbered,your off/def gains are penalized. So go for good armor, but watch the weight. Worry about their hits bouncing off entirely as well.
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Post by Procrastination on Nov 20, 2015 0:33:27 GMT -5
Let me give you the quick snuff of it.
If you have a weapon skill, using that weapon will give you hidden 'vs (examplecreaturetypehere: Insects).
So lets say a warrior. He has slashing. He's using a sword. Use sword against a scrab. You're training your (slashing), your (slashing vs. Insects), and then your offense. If you miss, that's offense ticks towards skill chance to go up as well. The same roll is done toward (slashing) on miss, as is on slashing vs critter, and base offense.
If in this scenario, said scrab hits you, because you have the parry skill, you get a check to possible skill up on parry. Blows bouncing off do not count. Armor deflecting, does not count(to the best of my knowledge and practice). If in this scenario, you are a class without (parry), simply being hit by the scrab at all will give you a base defense check to raise base defense. If you're a warrior, the way you raise base defense is by invalidating 'parry'. IE-Remove your weapons, and let the son of a bitch hit you once.
So think of an order of operations, to check which gets skill up, for defense.
First-If using shield, and the opponent's hit gets through, the check for a chance to skill up for (shield-use) goes through. Nothing lower on the tree can possible see a skill up than shield use.
Second-If parry skill, and the opponent's hit gets through, the check for a chance to skill up for (parry) goes through. If capable of parrying with current weaponry, nothing lower on the tree can see a skill up.
Third-If no skill (parry) and no skill (shield-use) being utilized, and hit gets through, the check for a chance to skill up for (base defense) goes through.
For offense, it's pretty across the board.
You swing with a weapon skill your class has- You miss (x10 preferably). Chance to skill up that weapon use type. Chance to skill up that weapon-use type vs (type of enemy), chance to skill up base offense.
You swing with a weapon skill your class does not have- You miss (x10 preferably). Chance to skill up that weapon type vs (type of enemy), chance to skill up base offense. No chance to skill up base weapon skill, as you do not have it.
This is the path to making a killing machine. Tread it lightly, for many will watch, and many will know what it is you are doing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2015 4:34:25 GMT -5
The biggest factor in skilling up offense and defense always came down to how many hours you can put in a day and how long you can survive. Repeating skill-fails 10 times is a waste of time in my experience. Repeating them at all, for that matter.
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Nov 20, 2015 4:45:46 GMT -5
The biggest factor in skilling up offense and defense always came down to how many hours you can put in a day and how long you can survive. none of that demonstrates how any of what he said is incorrect Repeating skill-fails 10 times is a waste of time in my experience. fine then continue doing u while the rest of us surpass u Repeating them at all, for that matter. ok now ur sounding like the broken record |
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Nov 20, 2015 7:09:35 GMT -5
As a warrior in the AoD, it reached a point I was not getting any "better" because of the way this game is designed. I had no access to things that I could miss, and resorted to using my recruits as a way to buff up my base defence (parry and shield use was maxed out).
I figured if I had a higher base defence, the recruits would miss more and so "train" faster. That's the route that a lot of combat leaders take as far as I know.
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Post by Procrastination on Nov 20, 2015 12:43:31 GMT -5
What it is really, is that alot of warrior leaders don't twink up their defense at first, wind up with a high offense, max parry, max shield use, middle ground weapon skills, and then have trouble getting the weapon skills up from then on. Defense and offense can be raised at any point pretty easily, but the real struggle is after you've gotten THOSE up, and you try to do anything else. Do off/def last. Unless you're anything other than a warrior. In which case, you twink defense hard before you get parry.
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Nov 20, 2015 13:36:36 GMT -5
Truth. I had very poor wisdom so I had pretty much given up the hope on branching advanced weapons.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2015 15:30:27 GMT -5
Why did wisdom matter in terms of branching advanced weapons?
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Nov 20, 2015 15:32:52 GMT -5
Wisdom directly affects the amount of "misses" needed to get the "chance" to skill up (using Procras's terms). That means someone with good wisdom has a better chance of increasing their weapon skills per miss than someone with very poor wisdom.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2015 15:38:52 GMT -5
But won't that issue be in their offense gain as well? So while it will take more time you can still get there like other characters?
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Nov 20, 2015 15:45:06 GMT -5
Nah. Weapon skills are special.
Edit: yeah I totally could have branched advanced weapon skills if I abandoned my clan docs, went out into the desert and sat down to swing at vultures and silt hawks like that one sponsored Byn Sergeant we came upon one patrol. But playing "legitimately" it wasn't going to happen.
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Post by Procrastination on Nov 20, 2015 18:02:18 GMT -5
It just gets harder and harder to do so, basically. You won't see these diminishing returns until your character has been alive for a few years usually on the average person. If you -know- how to twink, and you do it alot, you'll see them sooner, but then your fear won't be raising skills after having gotten your off/def up.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2015 19:00:34 GMT -5
But won't that issue be in their offense gain as well? So while it will take more time you can still get there like other characters? Base O and D have a timer somewhere between 12 and 24 hours long. You can only get 1 skillup in that time frame, max. Weapon skill + base O + a few modifiers = accuracy. Most people can only get a certain amount of defense to train on, so, the faster your weapon skill raises, the higher it will get before rising base O chokes your characters remaining progress. This is why people "twink", and why they practice combat skills in particular order. To reliably get past high journeyman / low advanced weapon skills, you have to get more than a certain number of weapon skillups per base O skillup you get. If you have any prayer of seeing a branched skill, you have to start out with a plan from day 1, survive the plan, and play -alot-. Wisdom determines your % chance of getting a skillup on any particular timer. If Ims dont want combat pcs to "twink", this has to change. I personally think they decided they couldnt make this change, so they opted to drive out players who care about things like high skills. |
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Post by Procrastination on Nov 20, 2015 19:20:07 GMT -5
Banme has the right of it. Though, I'm personally not too sure about the 24 hour lockout on off/def. I'm pretty sure at the very least, defense doesn't work like that. You can get someone to be considerably less defensively squishy through careful twinkery, without the parry skill, within a RL week. Not astoundingly so, but much harder to hit than a simple 7 clocked fails would allow for.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 20, 2015 19:28:46 GMT -5
The biggest factor in skilling up offense and defense always came down to how many hours you can put in a day and how long you can survive. none of that demonstrates how any of what he said is incorrect Repeating skill-fails 10 times is a waste of time in my experience. fine then continue doing u while the rest of us surpass u Repeating them at all, for that matter. ok now ur sounding like the broken record I wasn't trying to demonstrate anything. I was just saying what my experience is. I've tried it both ways. Like someone else said, a bigger worry is your offence getting too high, to where you can't raise your weapon skills due to not missing. I never had to grind 10 failures in a row to get to that point (high journeyman to advanced). Not to mention off-def would have to function completely different to all other skills if this were the case, don't need multiple fails for them. Also, characters surpassing mine has never been an issue. I generally die before they get to. I'm sure an ex-staffer would know this anyways, we got a couple around don't we? It's seriously one of the first things I'd look up if I were on staff. |
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