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Post by shakes on Feb 11, 2019 17:38:19 GMT -5
Most of my successful PK's have been related to the scenario. There was a degree of stalking or luring. In that regard, I had to engineer the victim's participation in some way in order to make the kill. And post-PK, in the city, strength had almost nothing to do with getting away with it. That falls into typing speed and getting lucky as to how many half-giant guards happen to be nearby.
In open desert PK, I've only RARELY run into a situation where it resulted in a PK due to raw, brute strength. Those were due to crits to the skull resulting in over 100 stun damage per pop. I can't see ANYTHING which would allow a player to completely avoid that situation. That's a problem, I think, which should be addressed. It could probably be handled with a simple damage cap on critical hits. I don't think there should ever be a situation where a non-sap/backstab attack should be doing over 100 stun damage.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2019 18:31:57 GMT -5
I blew up at staff a couple of days ago just because you know darn well they all play nothing but nobles, mind benders and high strength muls.
Staff cannot play nobles. Staff cannot play 'any' sponsored roles, period. Whenever a staff character gets put into a leadership position via gameplay due to absence of other leadership, or promoting through the ranks, it is a subject of much conversation and is often avoided, unless simply necessary.
Some newer staffers do have a tendency to play higher karma roles. Anaiah, who participates on this board, was known to play sorc/bender/sorc/bender/sorc/sorc/bender almost exclusively. She wasnt the only one. It was common for newer staffers to do that. It would be common for most of you as well, if you made staff and passed the probation period (you used to have your karma increased if you passed probation period as staff) and suddenly got access to roles you've never played.
Most staff who've been at it for awhile, no longer play high karma roles. Mainly because they require too much interaction with staff and most of them play to enjoy the game and rest from staffing for awhile. Being a sorc/mindbender makes you borderline staff. With all that oversight, the time requirements, and the need to actually be beneficial to the game as whole. It doesn't mean that they cant!!! They just dont. It's nice to say that staff only play high karmas, just to say "Those Meanies are hogging all the good spots, while we, the proletariat, are stuck in the rut!" But it's simply bullshit.
What is more common though is for veteran players to become staff, Then in half a year, after they passed probation, they quit and start playing nobles, sorcs and psies all the time. They have more time to do it now since they're not staff and less oversight now that they're players. That is a peculiar dynamic that I cant truly decide if it's good, or bad for the game. It does create a version of an 'in club' that so many people here are alluding to. There is no "in club" amongst staff. There's too much oversight. Staff playing characters will have less things allowed to happen in terms of Admin decision, then a normal player. But the people who 'used' to be staff and are now just players, they do enjoy certain preferential treatment. Mostly in sense of trust. They've been part of plots as staff and helped out on whatever projects. So there's a sense of camaraderie. Between in jokes and shared experiences, as well as earned reputation for bringing more content into the game. I noticed they do enjoy preferential treatment. Often, it is earned. Often, those players "are" excellent. Those players have played the most powerful guild (ie Staff), so they no longer persue 'winning Arm', they've already won it. So they often play characters that focus on creating content more, instead of victimizing other people for personal hard on (Let's admit, there are a lot of people like that). But at times, assholes, or more commonly lameasses, happen even amongst those people. A giaaaant percentage of people that you know and respect, people who've played leaders that were less murderous and more content creation, are often ex staff. And those who werent, will either become staff eventually, or have already chose not to numerous times.
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Post by jcarter on Feb 11, 2019 18:54:04 GMT -5
can you link to the exact post that shows a single point of strength means you're now doing double damage? because this post has a bigger gap and doesn't show that. Oh come on, John. Before I agree to do this, please understand that my original point was that you're taking this whole direction too seriously. we're talking about the code and dissecting it to understand how it works. this is an evidence-based discussion, you can't just make wild claims and expect people aren't going to push back when their own posted analysis runs completely counter to it. And more to the point I loathe digging through old posts. If I were going to dig through any archives, I'd rather dig through the Federal Archives to find out what dirt Kennedy had on Johnson. Nonetheless, I found it. But we both know better, because damage per hit is a much less interesting metric in most cases than damage per second, with an exception that I'll point out in a second. In the case of the guy who gets +1 strength compared against the +2 strength guy using said weapon against said armor, my character gets more than double damage per second, because the weapon damage is variable even before location is factored in, for the same level of skill. What that means is that I'll be occasionally scoring little one damage shots that will have been absorbed if you scored the same hit on the same location, because your hit was completely absorbed on the armor while mine had just enough momentum to punch through for one hit point of damage. Not a huge difference, but this means slightly more than double damage per second. ...ok? what you said versus the reality of it are two different things. you claim that a point of strength will lead to double damage. maybe it's technically true, but it's an edge case that is extremely rare and ultimately misleading to claim that one point is going to get you double damage when that's not the case 99% of the time. again, not sure what has reversed the argument and i need direct evidence to back it up beyond someone saying 'i think x works like this' without any code or parses to back it up.. i've posted snippets of code in this thread that show the importance of todam and the crazy scaling it gives. The proof is that plenty of people have fun with characters that aren't high strength. 1) that's not what i'm asking for proof of. claiming 'people have fun with it' is not evidence to back up the claim "recently supplied data has effectively upended your stance that strength is everything" 2) no one is telling you you can't have fun with a low strength character. no one has suggested that. do whatever, play whatever the heck you want. no, my central thesis is not that. it has been posted multiple times in this thread, but here it is again. the flow of the argument is very simple: 1) players and staff frown upon players suiciding characters, a behavior which is largely driven for the desire to have a better stat roll. 2) players want a better stat roll because it provides them a large boon to gameplay and they are willing to spend a couple hours to optimize a character they spend hundreds of hours on. 3) this issue may be sidestepped entirely by removing a system which is unfun and unfair to the players and allowing players to allocate stat points, as is the standard of most roleplaying games. |
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faroukel
Displaced Tuluki
What's a story without a villain?
Posts: 201 
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Post by faroukel on Feb 12, 2019 9:49:50 GMT -5
while it doesn't matter, I've always been a fan of players attributing their own stats. Maybe there's a template based off of race, then a smattering of loose points to be put where the player wants them.
it seriously sucks, when you go through the chargen process, write a desc, a background, pick skills, et cetera, and then your random roll of stats completely is off what you had intended for the pc.
"oh, my colossal brute of an orc is super smart and ridiculously weak. awesome!" "yay! my scribe can bench press 300 lbs, but doesn't know how to read!" are things you'll never hear, and happen often enough (although probably not to such an extreme).
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vulcan
staff puppet account
Posts: 28
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Post by vulcan on Feb 12, 2019 12:34:25 GMT -5
It all boils down to time. If they expect you to invest copious amounts of your time to each character then they need to provide the environment where doing so is entertaining and fulfilling for you. It is unreasonable to expect someone to spend DAYS of their lives playing an absolute dog turd of a character simply because suiciding them is against your misplaced moral code. First and foremost staff should be facilitating the enjoyment of their players. If your players are telling you time and again that something is wrong, well, by golly, something just might be wrong! Instead of getting pissy at them for doing things that prevent prolonged suffering and misery on the players part (suiciding a character that would be a trial to play) fix the cause of the pain rather than rant about the fallout from the symptoms.
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seuly
Clueless newb
Posts: 103
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Post by seuly on Feb 12, 2019 13:52:56 GMT -5
False. Staff can and do. There are even policies in Staff documentation that permits it if applications have not provided suitable players and concepts for the role. Admin have to approve it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2019 15:29:05 GMT -5
False. Staff can and do. There are even policies in Staff documentation that permits it if applications have not provided suitable players and concepts for the role. Admin have to approve it. Can you give me an example of a sponsored role that was ran by an imm? Its a little unfair to ask, but if its somewhere in open access, could you link me to where you get this? Its feasable for a staffer to create an avatar of some clan rank to facilitate recruitment, etc. But an actual sponsored role ... sorry, but you are wrong. |
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seuly
Clueless newb
Posts: 103
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Post by seuly on Feb 12, 2019 15:34:59 GMT -5
False. Staff can and do. There are even policies in Staff documentation that permits it if applications have not provided suitable players and concepts for the role. Admin have to approve it. Can you give me an example of a sponsored role that was ran by an imm? Its a little unfair to ask, but if its somewhere in open access, could you link me to where you get this? Its feasable for a staffer to create an avatar of some clan rank to facilitate recruitment, etc. But an actual sponsored role ... sorry, but you are wrong. No, I am not wrong. No, it is not open source documentation. Yes, Staff can and do play sponsored and Nobles roles if okayed by that Clan’s Admin. Its been done in Borsail, Oash, Bards, Muark, Kurac, Kadius, Salarr, Byn, and more. |
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Jeshin
GDB Superstar
Posts: 1,516
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Post by Jeshin on Feb 12, 2019 15:42:05 GMT -5
Staff can also have multiple PCs at the same time. It makes the sting of rolling low strength easier to suffer through when you can just have 2 or more PCs  |
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Post by shakes on Feb 12, 2019 16:49:45 GMT -5
I have no problem with staff playing multiple PC's OR taking a sponsored role ... IF ... they are doing it to simply smooth over and facilitate the collaborative narrative.
But I can see how it can cause a lot of problems. You get killed by one of those characters? There's some suspicion there as to whether they used there staff-knowledge to do it outside the narrow IC knowledge of the character they were inhabiting, not to mention the possible reasoning for your death. Or you can't seem to get ahead in your plots against that sponsored role or character, you're going to wonder if it's because they're using their staff knowledge against you. Or if you do win, there's a lingering worry that they might be upset and take it out on you in other ways.
At the end of the day, there's got to be a lot more trust between staff and players than I currently see present in order for this to not cause bad feelings. That level of fraternization is just going to breed problems.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2019 18:13:09 GMT -5
Can you name one such sponsored role?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2019 19:45:28 GMT -5
Can you name one such sponsored role? Siamaca Kadius. The rest I have on a list I'm only 80% sure.
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seuly
Clueless newb
Posts: 103
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Post by seuly on Feb 12, 2019 23:01:03 GMT -5
Can you name one such sponsored role? Siamaca Kadius. The rest I have on a list I'm only 80% sure.
There are quite a few posts throughout these forums pointing out where Staff have played Sponsored Roles too. |
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Post by pinkerdlu on Feb 12, 2019 23:18:36 GMT -5
Should just learn to ignore qwerty's posts or simply flame him.
Evidence/facts/numbers/dozens of similar anecdotes mean absolutely nothing to him.
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vulcan
staff puppet account
Posts: 28
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Post by vulcan on Feb 13, 2019 6:35:40 GMT -5
False. Staff can and do. There are even policies in Staff documentation that permits it if applications have not provided suitable players and concepts for the role. Admin have to approve it. Can you give me an example of a sponsored role that was ran by an imm? Its a little unfair to ask, but if its somewhere in open access, could you link me to where you get this? Its feasable for a staffer to create an avatar of some clan rank to facilitate recruitment, etc. But an actual sponsored role ... sorry, but you are wrong. What fucking rock have you been living under? For real, dude? Staff can and has run roughshod over any and all rules they have ever enacted since the mud has existed. |
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