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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Aug 3, 2018 11:28:48 GMT -5
yeah you red commie socialist scum, grind for grind's sake all day every day no life or no game scrub this is what you get for having a job
fuck outta here with your "but muh time" casuals don't deserve the chance at bolstering numbers and potentially having a go at making arm at least slightly more interesting
anyone else excited for when the player counts drop so low so the staff won't even bother logging in so we can grind without getting caught grinding too much?
me too, summer break 2020's gonna be great
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eru
staff puppet account
Posts: 40
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Post by eru on Aug 3, 2018 12:05:48 GMT -5
Investments and returns, my lil Marxist buddy. Its simple, and fair.
Everyone has the same equality of opportunity to either invest their time into an endeavor, or not. Equality of opportunity is fair, and moral.
Equality of outcome is not only unfair, but immoral.
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Aug 3, 2018 12:09:20 GMT -5
the ideas of maintaining equality of opportunity and casual accessability are not mutually exclusive
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Post by shakes on Aug 3, 2018 12:14:43 GMT -5
I haven't noticed that these extreme casuals AREN'T advancing. Every clan or group I've ever been in has had one as a leader who only logs in once every 5 days to strut and preen, hand out some orders, and then disappear again.
A few notable exceptions with leaders who play regularly, but their extreme casual status doesn't seem to be hurting their chance at sponsored roles or leadership.
I especially love the ones who show up after you've been in the clan for 1 RL month and then say, "Oh, you're the new guy? Here's my list of rules for what you can't do without my permission." And then they disappear another RL month.
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Post by shakes on Aug 3, 2018 12:18:19 GMT -5
the ideas of maintaining equality of opportunity and making the game more accessable to casual players are not mutually exclusive This is absolutely true, but I feel turning Armageddon into an idle-clicker may not turn out well. It's holding on to the population it has BECAUSE of the way it is, not despite the way it is. I also play Eve Online, sporadically. I can log on 5 minutes, check my market orders and adjust them, start up an industry job, and then set up a contract for someone else to haul my goods to Jita to be sold. Then I'll log off and won't return for a few days. Would I do better if I started my industry job with minerals I mined for myself and then hopped in my own hauler and hauled them and then sat at the keyboard all day constantly checking my market orders to make sure I'm the best price available? Absolutely. But that's not how I like to play that game. |
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Aug 3, 2018 12:34:20 GMT -5
the ideas of maintaining equality of opportunity and making the game more accessable to casual players are not mutually exclusive This is absolutely true, but I feel turning Armageddon into an idle-clicker may not turn out well. It's holding on to the population it has BECAUSE of the way it is, not despite the way it is. I also play Eve Online, sporadically. I can log on 5 minutes, check my market orders and adjust them, start up an industry job, and then set up a contract for someone else to haul my goods to Jita to be sold. Then I'll log off and won't return for a few days. Would I do better if I started my industry job with minerals I mined for myself and then hopped in my own hauler and hauled them and then sat at the keyboard all day constantly checking my market orders to make sure I'm the best price available? Absolutely. But that's not how I like to play that game. EVE has a system i dig. casuals can have their fun with it, and hardcore players can excel should they put time into it not entirely sure how arm would turn into an idle-clicker with a similar method, since (i'm led to believe) RP is the main point of it. as far as arm holding on to it's population because it's a time-consuming grind to get good at anything that opens doors to more RP, i'd disagree. though i can only speak for myself and a few friends that used to play, our main reason for leaving was the huge timesink. |
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Post by shakes on Aug 3, 2018 12:44:43 GMT -5
What features in Arm would make it more casual friendly? Without just giving away everything for free to anyone.
I think there are quite a few roles which are casual friendly, but what happens to many (myself included) is that I can't get the social interaction in those roles. The adventurer/forester in the wild? Won't lack for combat ability, won't lack for money, but if you only play sporadically you're not going to meet people. No problem if you've got 20 active Arm's on your AIM list who will immediately invite you into their social circle and treat you like their lost besty, but if you don't then you'll wander around the wilderness playing Arm the Single Player Experience until you die or store out of boredom and go play another single player game.
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Aug 3, 2018 12:57:03 GMT -5
the sacred skill grind, for starters
low and slow passive and offline skill gains, perhaps even up to a cap, would do a lot to nix the time sink while still maintaining higher gains for higher play times-- would also kinda make sense IC too, what does my character even do when i'm logged off?
combine something like that along with killing the skill level indicators and i'd wager this would make previously casual unfriendly roles a little more casual friendly, or at the very least offer the perception that they are.
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mehtastic
GDB Superstar
Armers Anonymous sponsor
Posts: 1,699
Member is Online
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Post by mehtastic on Aug 3, 2018 15:13:19 GMT -5
When you get to talking about playing a game in the same way you talk about making an investment, you have to step back and determine whether you're getting what you expect out of said investment.
Hobbies do require a time investment to get something out of it, obviously, but people get something enjoyable for their time. When investing time in family or friends, you're trying to build good relationships. When you invest time into a career, you're making money and perhaps trying to distinguish yourself as capable enough to advance in position.
What do you get out of a time investment in Armageddon? Increasingly, players earn less and less as staff take away options, refuse to work with players on plot lines, and drop the hammer on those who spend too much time doing something "bad". Players themselves make it difficult to invest time in the game, gravitating towards those who invest the most time and forcing others to either compete, or choose between the game and their life. Most rational people would choose their life, and most new accounts end up doing exactly that, according to the numbers staff released in the past.
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Post by pinkerdlu on Aug 3, 2018 15:32:21 GMT -5
Yes ^
Sinister, Lyse. Luv u sweeties. But your ideas re: filthy casuals are pants-on-head retarded.
The time investment is what makes Armageddon special, too. Am I in a position, personally, where I think the time investment of Arm is worth it? No. The current staff are a mockery, player numbers are LOW, and I'm too focused on work, the gym, etc. Passive/offline skill gain is one of the stupidest ideas I've seen in awhile, straight from the GDB. And I'm not going to get SO UPSET that someone DARE suggest I do something else with my time if I can't put a worthwhile investment (of my own time, effort, skill) into Armageddon. Cause it's supposed to be FUN! Give me a break.
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Post by shakes on Aug 3, 2018 15:44:22 GMT -5
Muds have always been for sort of a niche, obsessive crowd. To try and say, "I want just as much progress as before when I was a broken and abnormal shut-in!" is going against the grain.
There's a couple of small QOL improvements, some of which have been mentioned here, which would help mitigate that. And I can't say that giving your character a life outside of your login time is a bad idea or anathema to roleplay. Just cap it somehow. Let you queue up say, 8 hours of training time, and go do your thing.
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Post by lyse on Aug 3, 2018 16:23:10 GMT -5
The thing is I’m not even arguing that someone that plays an hour a day should somehow be equal to someone that plays on the other extreme end of the spectrum. I’m especially not talking about an hour a day player playing a sponsored role.
Let’s be real here, this is about combat ability. Combat is the only real grind here. If you play a crafter, an hour a day is fine and you’d be advanced in no time. Same with playing a ‘gick. So we can stop pretending the game is built around a grind. It’s not; combat is the only true grind.
I’ve never been an hour a day player. I’ve seen enough of them to know most people don’t put in extreme hours. There’s a handful and there’s nothing wrong with that. The problem I see there is that minority within that minority that decide the other end of the spectrum shouldn’t be playing.
So you come across a player that logs in for an hour a day. So what? Just include them when they’re on. It’s not that hard. The only place it matters in combat roles and it shouldn’t.
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jkarr
GDB Superstar
Posts: 2,070
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Post by jkarr on Aug 3, 2018 16:53:32 GMT -5
So you come across a player that logs in for an hour a day. So what? Just include them when they’re on. It’s not that hard. The only place it matters in combat roles and it shouldn’t. and there is literally no one saying leave anyone out when theyre on |
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Aug 3, 2018 17:39:31 GMT -5
Passive/offline skill gain is one of the stupidest ideas I've seen in awhile, straight from the GDB. any particular reasons you think it would be a silly idea? good chance i've just gotten so disconnected from the game after going so long without playing, but I'm having trouble figuring out any real reason something along those lines wouldn't work out beyond "it would make my character feel less special" or something feelsy like that. |
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Post by shakes on Aug 3, 2018 18:34:18 GMT -5
It would depend upon the way it's implemented.
Give a player a choice of 1-3 "activities" to perform when they log out to cover the next few RL hours. If the guy isn't going to log in for a week, no matter.
HELP QUIT OFFLINE
When quitting offline, you are saying that you're going to be away for a period of time and you're stating to the game the virtual activities you would like your player to engage on.
1. FORAGER - Quitting offline in a wilderness area, with a character who has the wilderness skill will grant about a day's worth of food and water when you log back in. You must be out of the game a minimum of 8 hours for this to take effect and a minor skill gain in forage skill will occur.
2. COMBAT - Clanned players in a sponsored clan will have presumed to have been training during this time and receive a minor boost to their skills.
3. TRADE - Quitting offline in a city area will allow for a small amount of trade to be conduct from your inventory and a portion of the sid will be left to you instead of the items. Not all items (no jewelry) are available for this, nor will you receive the full value as if you had sold it to an NPC.
Syntax example: QUIT OFFLINE TRADE
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