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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:18:00 GMT -5
Steal. And hide branches from sneak. If you haven't got a subguild that gives sleight of hand, it might take more than 3d to max out even at maximum efficiency. They made that skill a bit slow to increase for some reason, which I don't think it used to be. Something happened in the last couple of years that seemed to make a number of skills increase by less than a whole point at a time.
So if you have to first branch some shit, I guess you might be looking at 4-5d instead of 3d. 3d is just the fastest I've done it, with like EG/EX wisdom, but that was a few years ago.
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Post by Azerbanjani on Feb 11, 2016 13:19:39 GMT -5
For leveling slight of hand I just need to practice unlatching shit on another person right?
And finally....
Whats the chance of actually stealing from someone in a crowded tavern at master steal.
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Feb 11, 2016 13:19:36 GMT -5
Pickpockets are the only ones who can peek/steal/unlatch properly. These are not skills that are "good enough" at advanced or whatever the other classes and subguilds can get them to. Not for most purposes, anyway. Not for the kind of shit that's fun, like stealing keys out of a closed pouch or seeing what Junior Agent Faghead keeps in his silk backpack. this is untrue. 60 steal (what burgs get) is the pt at which u stop failing misses with most small items and coins. things like keys, herbs, and small wpns are easy as fuck to steal at that lvl - and that is before u even account for the agility bonus burgs get on top of when/if u prioritize it. burgs also get 80 sleight of hand, which is master lvl - this also before guild and priority agility boosts are even factored in. burglars will not be doing 'shit pickpocket people do' like reliably stealing heavier weapons off their marks but they will have no problems lifting off small items or opening packs, moreso if they roll a high agi its for this reason that the last three burgs of mine i can remember consistently had no probs with sleight of hand or steal for small items with agi ranges from except to very good peek otoh is too low to be reliable tho ull get away with the fails if ur hidden (dont spam them tho because imms can and will slam u for doing it too much) People don't leave their truly valuable and important shit in apartments, because apartments get looted fairly regularly. also very untrue statement, ppl always leave their shit in there, but agreed that pickpockets do get a wider range of cooler shit they can pretty much guarantee happening like stealing mid-sized weapons and other heavier items from their targets but they better be not linger too long because their hide sans stealth gear is easily spotted by rangers (who aside from nobles/aides tend to carry some of the most valuable shit) |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:22:32 GMT -5
You said it yourself: 60 steal will let you steal small things out of inventories. Anything more than that is too unrealiable at burglar level steal. You're not gonna be stealing longswords, or anything in pouches under cloaks. Not safely enough to get away with it on a regular basis.
You simply must be a pickpocket to get no-fail peeking into covered containers, or stealing semi-weighty things out of containers. Others can only steal tickets and shit like that, and can never get guaranteed success stealing out of containers.
Even with 90 sleight of hand and AI agility, unlatching has about a 5% chance to fail. It never becomes no-fail. With 80, it's probably more like 10%. That's not good enough for serious business. Only pickpockets can do it well enough to make a habit of it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:26:20 GMT -5
once i was playing a naki templar, and corporal cross was there being played by Waroth
nessalin inhabits a red robe, gives the bronze longsword to the corporal, then poofs.
naturally, corporal cross wore the bronze longsword sheathed on his belt, and it was stolen literally almost immediately.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:36:09 GMT -5
For leveling slight of hand I just need to practice unlatching shit on another person right? And finally.... Whats the chance of actually stealing from someone in a crowded tavern at master steal. You don't need to be unlatching other people's shit. Just latch and unlatch your own pouch or whatever. You can max the skill this way, but they did something to make it take longer when they added the latch/unlatch code. I don't think it matters how crowded a room is. If your steal is maxed, you have basically 100% chance to steal anything that's light, like a mount ticket or anything like that. A medium-sized weapon, like a shortsword, will be nearly guaranteed as well, but it can fail once in a rare while. The biggest thing you can steal is usually about the weight of a longsword, and that's probably got somewhere around 80% chance to succeed at maxed steal. I feel that there's a penalty for stealing something that the person is wearing on their belt, but it's frankly hard to get a lot of testing data on things like this. It's just a hunch. Stealing something near the weight limit (which I wanna say is about 10 stones or so) from inside a worn backpack, that's tough. You might be looking at odds as low as 50%. |
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Post by Azerbanjani on Feb 11, 2016 13:43:53 GMT -5
So Tavern doesn't actually take into account shit and its just a thing of "Can people notice me doing this with watch/scan/whatever"
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:48:32 GMT -5
Yeah. And scan doesn't let people notice what you do, that just lets them detect you when you're hidden. Watch is what will interfere with your sneaky actions, and being watched will really fuck you up. It basically gives you like -50% chance to succeed any sneaky action, even if their watch skill is shit. Most people just go through life with novice watch since it only increases when they fail to notice a sneaky action by someone they're watching, and that's kinda hard to grind. If you want to grind watch, go watch rats hide/sneak around. It's boring but it works.
Watch won't stop you from hiding, but it'll let a succesful watcher detect you as though they had infallible scan. Max hide can overcome low watch, though, and most people don't have high watch. There's probably like a 50% chance that you will "slip out of sight" and cause them to stop watching you. Watch will cause your steal and sneak attempts to actually fail, though. Always make sure nobody is watching you. If you look at or assess somebody, it'll tell you if they're watching you.
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Post by Azerbanjani on Feb 11, 2016 13:49:41 GMT -5
So master steal.
Find stupid people.
Take all their shit.
All of it.
Anything that isn't weighed down.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:50:44 GMT -5
No, that's shitty. Treat NPCs like crap if you want, those are fair game, but don't twink out against players. Steal what you have a reason to steal. If you go too far, you just fuck yourself over as people will stop carrying anything worth stealing when it becomes known that there's a twink thief around.
I advocate using NPCs to overcome the game's awful skillgain system, but to treat players like you would want them to treat you. It's a matter of principle.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2016 13:59:48 GMT -5
pickpockets are fucking useless. pick warrior every time and just beat them to death for their loot yes, I am badskeelz My liking of this post is predicated on your not actually being BadSkeelz. If it turns out you are, I withdraw my support. Sincerely, Her Royal Highness, Prince Hyacinthus |
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Feb 11, 2016 14:21:56 GMT -5
You said it yourself: 60 steal will let you steal small things out of inventories. Anything more than that is too unrealiable at burglar level steal. You're not gonna be stealing longswords, or anything in pouches under cloaks. Not safely enough to get away with it on a regular basis. i didnt specify inventories but implicit in it was including from inside containers. i had no probs stealing small items from open packs and bags with those burgs You simply must be a pickpocket to get no-fail peeking into covered containers, or stealing semi-weighty things out of containers. Others can only steal tickets and shit like that, and can never get guaranteed success stealing out of containers. i had no noticeably higher chance of failure stealing keys/tickets/light items from open containers, and nothing in my experience suggests there is more difficult factored in when stealing from inside worn or carried containers if that were indeed true it is likely that having the reasonable agility my chars did was what offset that higher difficulty enough to where it was reliable. the only thing that seemed to have any direct impact on my pps or burglars success was weight, whether in a container or not Even with 90 sleight of hand and AI agility, unlatching has about a 5% chance to fail. It never becomes no-fail. With 80, it's probably more like 10%. That's not good enough for serious business. Only pickpockets can do it well enough to make a habit of it. even accounting for ur generous margin of pctg error for burgs and pps with agility that high, ur not accounting for the rarity of crit fails comprising that 5-10% margin u gave. what this means is that 5-10%, even 15% chance of failure is more than adequate for 'srs business' on a consistent basis thanks to partial fails being far more common than crits when the skill check isnt passed. stealth may boost that as well |
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Post by Azerbanjani on Feb 11, 2016 14:40:56 GMT -5
Does stealing get a boost from sneaking or only hiding?
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Feb 11, 2016 15:21:51 GMT -5
hiding may reduce ur chance of getting a crit fail, beyond making it easier to stay undetected when u partial fail
cant confirm abt sneak ie if ur currently sneaking whether ud get another boost just because ur sneaking flag is on. doesnt seem likely since boost from hide based on being successfully hidden when u make the attempt but sneak isnt a static state ur 'successfully' in as it only applies when ur moving from room to room so it may not factor into the success
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grumble
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Post by grumble on Feb 11, 2016 16:20:12 GMT -5
I know you can get watch to journeyman by watching people you're sparring, it can fail to catch the "assess" command... also, mudsexing with hemotes can get it to a decent level. But anyone who wants to help twink out a sneaky ever in their lives should grind watch, and find an IC reason for doing so, semote watches %woman dress sway intently as #me quietly slips along in the crowd.
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