Is what happens in the Tablelands truly something that your regular Amos would have heard about in 'Nak? No. Nakki's don't care who's killing who, who's dying where as long as it's not them and it doesn't directly affect their city-state. Same as someone of the Pah could give two fucks about some sewer rats crawling out of the sewers to devour unattended babies.
Yeah guys, why would anyone in 'Nak have any interest whatsoever in the Gith?
Not like scaly bastards regularly raid anyone travelling between Luir's and Allanak-- or once tried to siege the most powerful city-state in relatively recent history, right?
Some of the most banal shit winds up on those rumor boards all the time and you know it.
If warnings of human PC raiders can land a headline in the news, I'd imagine tribes of perhaps the most reviled race in The Known getting their shit stomped in deserves at least a mention.
Krelezrox, you're going to have to try a little harder than that to make your point, as well as drop the self-righteous bollocks, and try speaking to people as if they were people, rather than how you speak to your red-headed stepchild with downs.
"grumble is actually a psychotic 40+ something weirdo who lives off the government doll and does nothing but play armageddon all day every day. he has no aspirations, he has no real meaning in his life. only armageddon, getting drunk, and having bizarre pseudo-relationships with the people who play with his characters, of which there is no line between reality and fiction. he exclusively plays elves. i cant make this stuff up." -topkekm8s
How often do people go into the Tablelands? For threat of the desert sharps and raiding, not often, I've seen this with my own eyes having played a long lived tribal PC. PC's and VNPC's travel between 'Nak and Luir's all the time, and scuffle with the gith there - traveling through the Pah is FAR less done. So, I'm sorry, but I stand by my opinion. If you don't like that you didn't hear anything about what happened in the Tablelands ICly, then perhaps PC's in 'Nak just weren't that interested in learning about it. Or, those who knew didn't Post anything on the rumor boards. Either or, there are still some PC's around from the tribes that this directly affected from some of the posted stories - you just have to look in the right places.
Or in any discussions about the game, for that matter. Literally nobody has ever so much as mentioned anything about the entire thing, either here or on the GDB, which is sufficient basis for the conclusion that it has not been a big enough part of the game to justify focusing most staff resources on, to the point of neglecting the rest of the game and allowing it to stagnate to shit. It's sad and funny at the same time because it was so predictable.
the known world has been stated to be approximately the size of the state of michigan.
within the known world, there's a handful of areas that sustain civilized life: tuluk, luir's, allanak+red storm, and the tablelands.
sorcery and void magick are some of the most terrifying things humans in Arm can encounter on the supernatural spectrum. not to mention organized gith action. gith are analogous to native americans during frontier days -- occasional incursions, raids, and attacks are serious but nothing to be majorly concerned about, but seeing them acting as a banded together army is a big deal. so for an organized gith army to be waging war led by sorcerers and void mages is a pretty huge deal.
also allanakis clearly do give a shit about what happens outside of allanak. allanak has waged wars and historically tried to expand out its reach all over the Known World.
so yeah, it's kind of dumb to pretend that an Allanaki would be completely oblivious to such a major and worrying threat occurring.
The whole thing didn't make me lose faith in the staff, just the players. They were all very poorly played from what I saw, especially the gith. The worst were all the players that wouldn't do anything without having a pow-wow to get approval with their imms. Then the imms give ambiguous responses because they want the players to make decisions and the players never do and just freeze up hoping things break their way. Makes the whole plot sluggish and lose momentum every time it would get going.
The game lacks enough players that look who is around, gather those around them and say let's go make shit happen. The staff supported those outings but the players would refuse to do them consistently because everything requires a 20 hour discussion that no one sees because everyone plays so secretive like all knowledge must be a hoarded gem. Then no one knows what happened in a plot because everyone clams up and the GDB won't even talk about characters that are 15 years old. Even this forum is barren on what actually happened, it's pathetic. It shouldn't be such a chore to know what the fuck happened in a "big" plot.
I know people don't try to make stuff happen because of what's happened in the past with staff shooting everything down but I honestly don't know how they can fix that because no one wants to even try anymore. Those that do can't gather enough people because no clans are large enough to support it alone (which is caused by clan caps, I know). And since people never know what's going on they have no idea how to get into the mix outside of asking staff, which they aren't apt to do.
You wished for more focus on Nak, newtwink, but if the players play like that everywhere then it's a lost cause. Fun stuff just can't happen because staff stifled fun for so long that now the players just stifle it themselves.
If I was on staff as an admin running a plot one of things I sure would do is write a public plot reflection after it's done. I'd say what went well, what didn't go well, what I wanted to go well etc. I'd even toss some shout outs to players that made it fun for me as an admin as well as explaining why and how. Then, maybe, after players see me say that I wish they'd have some balls to throw caution to the wind and gather a crew to attack something then maybe they would start doing it. It'd also give some good, solid, positive reinforcement to vets that probably need some public kudos for playing kick ass characters. It'd get staff and players on the same page about plots and how to make the game fun instead of having the mammoth divide where players chat on skype about how bored they are and staff write on their forum about how players just won't get involved. Do I care if X player is still around? Not really, if it makes more people play with a character that makes stuff happen, awesome. If it makes people play to take down that character, just as awesome. Would I call out a puppet master character that was great? No, I'd let them know in private. But there are enough leader characters out there that are visible and letting a few know they did a good job and X clan had some fun might keep the game's momentum going.
This game needs to be a place where you're excited to log in because you never know what might happen that night. Not one where you just check your clan forum to see when X event is going to happen and know it's going to be a 4 and a half hour snooze fest that could have just taken an hour or two if it happened spur the moment and would have been a hell of a lot more exciting.
That stuff is why I gave up on the game. I don't hold out hope for any of that shit to turn around. The reason I keep bringing up Allanak is that this is the one place where things can work out even with half-assed support -- but not with absolutely no support, which is what it has been getting since Seidhr became head of the southlands.
The thing is that when you put all the chips on some Tablelands plot and it doesn't work out, everything is shit. It's like deciding not to boil the potatoes because you're going all in on the gravy, but if you then fail with the gravy, every part of the meal is shit. You could have boiled the potatoes and at least had something edible. If you make Allanak the focus of the game, there's a limit to how bad things can get even if your main plan fails. You've still got a stable city environment to fall back on. However, if you've neglected that for months and done nothing whatsoever to support player actions in that sphere, you don't have anything. Then you've managed to disappoint players everywhere.
Between numerous tribes getting culled and Tuluk closing, something like 80% of the game's clans now operate out of Allanak. Basically all of Armageddon save for House Kurac and the Tablelands tribes is based in this one sphere. To not make this the focus of the game is so monumentally insane that anyone behind this decision should be legally banned from ever holding any position of authority. It's so outrageously stupid and short-sighted, I simply cannot fathom how they ever came to decide that this was what's best for the game. Perhaps they didn't actually think this was best for the game but did it anyway, which is almost as bad but at least doesn't require that they're actually insane, merely incompetent.
Even if the Tablelands plot had gone well, it was still a questionable decision to make such a remote and primitive area the focus of the game's story. If only 20% of the playerbase can realistically participate and the plot isn't significant enough for the city of Allanak to even fucking hear about it, even the best case scenario isn't good enough to justify that kind of delegation of resources. But then again, it shouldn't have to take up the majority of staff's resources, because the game has sixteen fucking staff members. I don't know what they do. I genuinely don't. They certainly can't seem to provide the level of storytelling that other RPIs have managed with staff rosters that can be counted on one hand.
I'd say it's a double-edged sword with the visibility of plots. Sometimes you'd have just the right amount of involvement with fun had by multiple clans. Sometimes you'd have a smorgasbord of participation from a bunch of people not even remotely connected to the plot who want to "kill stuff". Other times you'd have non-plots and dumb made up rumors causing the entire playerbase to unreasonably mobilize against one random 2 karma magicker halfway across the Known.
And so far as I know, it was only the involved clan staff that really did much with that set of plots. I believe admins stick to their area unless needed elsewhere. So if nak didn't have anything going on that's probably not because of the T-Lands business.
This is an awesome thread. Great observations all the way around, really. I agree with the points mentioned about what the players are doing wrong. But I point the blame in equal measure to both sides. Current imms are in so much denial you almost have to wonder if they're joking. Look at the things desertman says on the gdb and how nergal and seidhr just can't even admit a single point he's raised (yes desertman, I'm defending you here). That kind of denial is practically a psychosis.
It used to be that when things were brewing in the world you'd feel the storyline ripple through the game. To all the posters raving about how the tablelands event wouldn't be known in nak I have to wonder why you would want to run a big event and not have it known across the game? Are you embarrassed of the story you're trying to weave? It goes back to the age old problem of Arm about keeping everything secret and in the dark. You used to have these amazing rumor posts clearly written by imms stating what was happening in the world. Those never happen anymore. There used to be a build up that you could feel even through multiple characters, whenever some imm run event was starting. That's also gone with the wind. The history page used to get updated with large world events describing all sorts of political upheaval and battles. Gone for good now, I'd say. How hard is it to run world wide events without making them light shows for players to simply watch? How hard is it to run world wide events that specifically weave their way into player actions rather than them not being in any way connected with players actions?
It just seems like the current crop of imms really don't even want to tell a story. Maybe they've paralyzed themselves with too many policies. Maybe they're as suppressed as the players who also never strive for anything anymore due to the constant culture of limitation. I think there's some agenda on their end to let players run their own plots and to be more hands off but that's only resulted in a quiet game world where all that exists are petty quarrels, mudsex dramas and more festival rpts. You may as well forget that the city states have any leadership or that there's a senate or that (NPC) defilers still walk the earth and pose a threat to the entire Known World (remember when staff said they'll still exist even if no PCs can run them and that you should expect to see or hear about them through IC events?) It's just a boring stale world where no actual stories take place anymore. Anyone defending the fact that the tablelands plot was downplayed and barely noticed throughout the game, I have to believe actually dislikes storytelling and deliberately wants the game to be boring.
grumble: Necker, however much I miss saying "Sup my necker?", was a bit much. I can do without it because I see the reason why it's a bad idea. I'm not sure too many were offended but one is enough.
Dec 14, 2020 9:53:34 GMT -5
someguy: Was thinking to come back and play as an elf since I won arm as a d elf and later as a c elf... then realized I'd have to revamp my vocabulary now...
Dec 18, 2020 14:55:09 GMT -5
jkarr: lol yeah some idiots zoomed in to take offense on behalf of black players who didnt two shits about an ig word that some white ppl decided to treat as an ooc slur fail to split ic from ooc and then have staff cave in to their crying by litrally banning it
Dec 18, 2020 17:27:35 GMT -5