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Post by triskelion on Oct 18, 2019 23:29:51 GMT -5
Some huge changes to poisons, archery, mob behavior, etc. recently, and not a whisper on here about it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2019 0:00:47 GMT -5
The new tracking code of the NPCs and their reaction to archery is very poorly tested. Please be careful guys. A lot of people could die idiotically due to it. Next time you go out to hunt, dont assume you can predict the NPCs behavior. Stay on your toes until you learn the way things are now.
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kannot
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Post by kannot on Oct 19, 2019 3:56:30 GMT -5
What about poisons and mob behavior, what happened?
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Oct 19, 2019 6:28:56 GMT -5
What about poisons and mob behavior, what happened? Some poison objects now decay like food does-- no more stockpiling in a save room. They won't state how long it takes. Aggro'd mobs will now chase you far above and beyond what they used to. No more getting a couple of rooms between yourself and the danger and calling it safe. The real bitch about the mob change is that it leads to packs of dangerous critters. Aggro'd a drov beetle or a yompar and tried running away? Congrats, you've aggro'd and passed by three more in your attempt to escape. Now there's a pack of them for someone else to deal with, if you manage to get away. Which, I'm all for a more dangerous wasteland experience, but this is a pretty cheesy way to do it.
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Oct 19, 2019 7:02:38 GMT -5
They made the mob AI dumber than it already was? Awesome. Maybe more players' PCs will die shitty deaths in this shoddily-designed game and their players will decide to move on to something better for once. (edited to add /s for any loonies who think this board is about destroying the game)
Item decay in general punishes casual players and rewards playing for 8+ hours a day, and is simply another way to keep players playing longer if they want coded power.
It probably wasn't discussed here because it was obvious it was yet another overcorrection for some players' behavior, in Armageddon producers' constant effort to make the game better by accidentally making it worse.
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Oct 19, 2019 7:49:14 GMT -5
Eh.
fwiw there are ways around decaying items
food can be preserved at low levels of cooking, keeping it from decaying, and poisons that are applied don't decay either (yet) so you can just slap that peraine on a cheap dagger and stockpile those.
and the decay timer only ticks down when the object is in-game, so if you quit with it in your inventory it's all gravy
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Oct 19, 2019 8:05:23 GMT -5
Yeah, I know about the decay timer only ticking down when the object's in-game, but that effectively forces casual players to burden themselves with all the stuff they want to preserve. A bunch of food and poisoned weapons will stack up, potentially to the point of pushing a PC up by one encumbrance level.
You can store food in certain preserving containers IIRC, but there is no way to preserve raw poison, and it's likely only a matter of time before applied poisons wear off too.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2019 11:03:04 GMT -5
It most likely will. Yeah.
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Post by shakes on Oct 19, 2019 13:54:41 GMT -5
The mob AI tracking code is what I have found most problematic. Not stuff chasing me, but when it chases someone ELSE for a long distance, they stack up in spots you're not used to finding them. Dujat and spiders waiting outside of Nak, raptors on the north road outside of Luir's, etc.
It's not really that big of a deal with an established character, but before you've got your ride/flee up that instahit, tracking mob when you just got thrown off your mount ... it's a killer.
I'd gotten used to having 'safe' spots to learn to ride with new characters, and those are no longer even remotely safe. I'll have to adapt.
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vex
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Post by vex on Oct 19, 2019 16:38:23 GMT -5
It's almost like they don't want players having a quiver full of peraine arrows, sheathes full of peraine throwing knives, and boots full of peraine daggers, as well as a belt full of back up glands 'just in case'. This is exactly the state of things with a particular group, who used extremely suspect behavior, to protect their peraine advantage, among other suspect behaviors...
The changes to peraine are, imo, not going to curtail that kind of 'power hoarding' behavior, because a high skill pc with great stats will be able to circumvent the challenges, it'll just be more tedious.
It will make it an actual commodity again, at least in places like Allanak. It'll also make people who can MASTER poison actually matter, since having rare poisons imported on a timer, means having someone who can do it with 95% coded assurance, will be invaluable.
Were I to venture a suggestion, it would be that certain weapons be flagged as 'poison keepers', where poison does not degrade (there are some that are, by description, designed with this in mind, but lack the coded feature). Have it last only a few days on other, regular weapons, and generally make poisons as illegal in Allanak as spice is, so we no longer have hunters hauling in bags of poison, to sell to vendors, like both parties aren't actually doing something highly illegal.
I would limit the 'decay' of raw poisons, to those that are appropriate. Not all poisons are organic, and not all of the organic ones would lose their potency because they dry out. In fact, if we assume they behave similar to rl poisons, some would actually become more potent if left to dry, and be ground into a powder. Brew craft, maybe?
I might also just make poisons something that you cannot sell to an npc, period. If it is strictly a trade among pcs thing, it encourages building those contacts, and not mass harvesting every red leaf plant, just because you can sell it in every town for hundreds of 'sids, like it were just another scrab shell. There is no point, if its likely to decay, and you have no one to sell it to, and have no use yourself.
I'd venture further, to make 'picking' poisons, or even handling certain poisons without gloves, give a chance to poison the user, decreasing with how high their poisoning skill is, or to a lesser degree, their brewing skill. To cut down on how easy it is for dumb warriors to just go plant to plant to plant, picking thousands of coins in poison plants, with zero risk of harm.
There are a lot of ways to make poison rarer, more dangerous, and more interesting, as well as less detrimental to the economy.
I don't have enough experience with the other changes, yet, but being able to 'pull' auto-flee small game is really, really great, as far as a quality of life change. It only diminishes ranged 'hunting', though, which was already rare due to arrows costing so much, or taking so long to make in number.
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Post by gloryhound on Oct 19, 2019 17:19:15 GMT -5
There was a time when you couldn't outrun NPCs (unless you knew a particular combat trick). You'd never get two rooms away, and they didn't wear out. You'd run until your mount was exhausted, and then you'd run until you were exhausted, and then it was over.
If you tried to ignore one as you moved along, more would be added to the posse. It forced you to kill everything that charged at you (or be killed).
It sounds like the game has gone back to this, pretty much.
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Oct 19, 2019 17:19:24 GMT -5
i could get down with a lot of this, tbh thoughts on decaying cure tablets? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
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Post by Prime Minister Sinister on Oct 19, 2019 17:23:17 GMT -5
There was a time when you couldn't outrun NPCs (unless you knew a particular combat trick). You'd never get two rooms away, and they didn't wear out. You'd run until your mount was exhausted, and then you'd run until you were exhausted, and then it was over. If you tried to ignore one as you moved along, more would be added to the posse. It forced you to kill everything that charged at you (or be killed). It sounds like the game has gone back to this, pretty much. ye kinda sucks tho, what with all the blind spots
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vex
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Post by vex on Oct 19, 2019 18:06:36 GMT -5
thoughts on decaying cure tablets? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Everything should wear down, or lose it's potency, or decay, with respect to what it is and what it is made from. Weapons should wear down, clothing should become worn and eventually threadbare, booze, milk and other non-water beverages should spoil, and raw materials like hides and other organics should become rotten, if not tanned or otherwise treated in time.
Tablet cures are, almost without exception, organic, so yes, they should decay, and turn to dust, with time. I'd give them a serviceable shelf life: a year or two is more than sufficient, and prevents clans from stocking chests full of cures, but without it becoming a tedious burden to maintain.
It is not without irony, that spice is one of the things I feel shouldn't decay, or at least take a rather long time to happen, to at least give it a chance of smuggling being a relevant PC endeavor. My sword made of volcanic glass will last a thousand generations of constant use against heavily shelled creatures and armored opponents, but my joint, unfortunately, will not last the week in my purse.
It is, imo, entirely too easy to become a 'set' PC, with your preferred armor set, your weapons of choice, your selection of poisoned sidearms in your sheath, a pocket full of cures for virtually all poisons, or your set of nice clothing and jewelry, and never need to replace or maintain any of it, for more or less the rest of your PCs life. If we all had required maintenance costs for our armor and weapons, fancy and expensive would be less common, and utilitarian, easy to replace or repair stuff, the normal.
Of course, it is a rather huge code endeavor, and I'd imagine I'm in the minority in wanting a reason for coins to matter beyond the first 10 days played. I find a lot of PCs are really, quite pleased, to be above bribery, or unwilling to accept money in place of blood (pk) for offenses.
All it takes for coins to be relevant beyond the early game of a pcs life, is for there to always be a need to maintain or replace everything you own, from the lowest elf to the highest Templar. Your lucky sword should be lucky because it somehow lasts you a decade, not because it happens to have dragon tits on the pommel. It should be both fairly impressive and extremely dangerous to be independently wealthy.
As it is, nobody even blinks, when random indie hunter casually mentions having twenty thousand coins, and nothing to spend it on. Decay is the answer, if done with respect to material.
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Post by shakes on Oct 19, 2019 18:46:56 GMT -5
I think some tips in the new world would be ...
Don't ride a war beetle right out of chargen. Too slow to escape. A tarantula's walking speed is about the same as a war beetle's running speed ... and you may fall off. Sunbacks and those cheap inix have become enormously more valuable.
Don't exhaust yourself anywhere. Period. Dangerous mobs are all over the place now, not just in the previous general spots they loaded.
Don't spam any combat commads with delays ... that's how I lost a recent character right after this change. I used threaten on a scrab and some freakin' spiders snuck in while I was in that delay. I could handle the scrab ... I couldn't handle a scrab and 2 spiders.
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