Jeshin
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Post by Jeshin on Sept 21, 2019 13:08:18 GMT -5
I do want to briefly point out that bringing change to Armageddon is not some war. Some of the very thinly veiled narrative tactics are pretty unnecessary in this thread. Especially when staff have already made the decision and now you're going to whine that they were forced into it? Armageddon is not singled out when it comes to young PCs and it is not the only MUD to get this heat. To imagine that it is and that it is in fact the shadowboards that is the big evil enemy that would dare bring up pedophilia is ignoring the fact that our hobby does still bring new people in, it's rare but it happens, and that the average person is going to be like uh what? when they hear about 13 year old adults on a game where we all know mudsex is an everyday occurence. CASE AND POINT - musoapbox.net/topic/2877/cyberrun?page=1The MUSH side of the genre a game called Cyberrun created by Tyr the owner of HavenRPG. It is an impressive push towards a webclient based next generation experiment but the owner in his idiocy in the opening blurb/pitch puts this line "Death has all but been eradicated while bioengineering and cyber-augmentations mean running into an 85 year old in a 12 year old body..." OBVIOUSLY he eventually cracked and the line now shows Death has all but been eradicated while bioengineering and cyber-augmentations mean running into an 85 year old in a 19 year old body or a hulking minotaur is an everyday occurence. The Text-based Gaming community as a whole MUDs or MUSHes do not accept the whiff of underage erotica especially on any game that makes any claim to serious/quality roleplaying. The shadowboard is not unique, Armageddon is not unique, you are not being persecuted you are being conformed to cultural norms. |
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delerak
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Post by delerak on Sept 21, 2019 13:23:27 GMT -5
Regardless of cultural norms. It is not illegal for two adults to engage in "underage" roleplay or whatever we're calling it. It's not illegal to do it in the privacy of their bedrooms, in a text message or online. The only problem is when you include others who don't wish to be a part of it.
While I can mute harassers in other games, muds do not offer that option, obviously an RPI cannot allow you to "mute" a PC. So what recourse do you have if someone is harassing you IC with OOC constructs?
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Sept 21, 2019 13:36:42 GMT -5
Regardless of cultural norms. It is not illegal for two adults to engage in "underage" roleplay or whatever we're calling it. It's not illegal to do it in the privacy of their bedrooms, in a text message or online. The only problem is when you include others who don't wish to be a part of it. While I can mute harassers in other games, muds do not offer that option, obviously an RPI cannot allow you to "mute" a PC. So what recourse do you have if someone is harassing you IC with OOC constructs? ur char has the best answer |
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Sept 21, 2019 13:39:40 GMT -5
Regarding the suddenness of the change, my guess would be that the reviewer's complaint coincided with things the staff had recently observed or been made aware of. Likely the reviewer made staff aware of it directly. It probably did involve an unwilling participant, so to speak - psionic dick-pics are more common than you'd think, for example - and it was only a matter of time before something changed. The review just tipped things over the edge.
Another, less likely IMO, possibility is that they were already walking on thin ice with their host and promised to solve issues and decided to get ahead of it once Exodus's review came out.
While I understand the free speech, sandbox argument to the extent that the only thing binding Armageddon to do anything is a Terms of Service agreement and not a government official, the staff aren't actively preventing their players from engaging in pedophilic roleplay, they're just closing off Armageddon as an avenue of that roleplay. Players who are interested in that stuff aren't prevented from taking that roleplay to a private conversation, another game, etc.
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Sept 21, 2019 13:48:25 GMT -5
Ah, well, possibly. It could be that, from an admin position who can invisibly see everything going on, there's a lot more sketchy filthy shit happening than we as players would ever know about. And they just don't want a light shining in there.  As someone who talks and has talked to a handful of former staff members, there's definitely that aspect to all of this. Of the staff members I talked to, I never asked them about Armageddon's sexual culture, and yet all of them complained to me, unprompted, about how filthy that shit really gets. Without going into details, the recent minimum age increase was long past due. |
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Jeshin
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Post by Jeshin on Sept 21, 2019 13:50:14 GMT -5
In the free speech angle. You are entitled to your speech but not the social response to follow. Armageddon could 100% be like it is the setting, we do not believe it's happening, end of story. This would cause a skeptical or condemning response but no one is pointing a gun to Armageddon's head. The only influence being applied is the label and ostracizing of the game for not conforming. Whether it's because a pedophilia scene exists or because the game will not change for creative integrity. The fact that the game has changed per the staff announcement is to distance itself from the label and ostracizing dialogue... Presumably maybe Godaddy got involved, iunno.
In the event of I am playing a 14 year old going about my day sometimes I suck dick to make sid sometimes I shiv a fool to steal his boots... But this one guy/girl is being extra pervy. I would probably just have your character be like bish I don't like you, you probably want to slit my throat after getting your rocks off or something to that equalivant. If that isn't your cup of tea report it to staff. Any game which allows underage characters should probably just accept a portion of staff time will end up being dedicated to policing complaints about and regarding those characters and people being creepy.
It all boils down to how does the staff want to spend their time. Nix it or administrate it.
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Sept 21, 2019 13:50:39 GMT -5
they prob did it so quickly to get ahead of the bad pr before it went viral
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tedium
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Post by tedium on Sept 21, 2019 13:51:13 GMT -5
This thread has been eye opening, but I think that my single favorite thing is Tyr making a Sex MU after all the debate over whether Haven was a Sex MU.
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baobob
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Post by baobob on Sept 21, 2019 16:33:44 GMT -5
Aren't Zalanthan years and ages a little more complex than 1:1? It seems weird that wasn't discussed once in the entirety of this shitstorm. That Zalanthans are fantasy human-adjacents who by definition are no longer children at biological age of thirteen might be a fact. But that claim doesn't do anything to cool the now public claims in the mudding community that people with bad intent deliberately seek Mudsex relationships with these young PCs to fulfill Loli/pedo fantasies and that they flock to ArmageddonMud to do so. I never witnessed that phenomena but a person or two here on this board at least have leap at a chance to claim they have, on Reddit or elsewhere. Maybe Exodus is a plant. Maybe the claims here supporting Exodus's claims are also false. Maybe both are true. Doesn't really matter much. ArmageddonMud had a choice of fighting and bleeding heavily on some mole hill of "principle" about human-adjacent not-children fantasy characters or making an easy change to starting age. Why the hell would they want that battle? Good riddance to real or imagined creepers, they can say, now. |
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Sept 22, 2019 14:46:24 GMT -5
More damage control on the reddit thread.
Another of the "IN ALL MY YEARS" defenses, coming out to prove a negative with anecdotal absence of evidence. You don't even know if that dickensian whelp was 13, bro. I swear, Lord Templar, her ID said she was old enough to kank!
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mehtastic
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Post by mehtastic on Sept 22, 2019 16:41:23 GMT -5
More damage control on the reddit thread.
Another of the "IN ALL MY YEARS" defenses, coming out to prove a negative with anecdotal absence of evidence. You don't even know if that dickensian whelp was 13, bro. I swear, Lord Templar, her ID said she was old enough to kank!
#1 is dumb because no one is arguing otherwise. As for #2, just because some games are worse about handling sexual themes doesn't mean Armageddon was good at it The amount of people who shat on Exodus just for writing a review goes to show, again, how unfriendly the game is to newbies and how bad the community is at player retention. Regarding #3, what stands out to me the most is the sheer denial involved. The post runs the gamut of most of the typical reactions to a negative review from the Armageddon playerbase: - you're lying - you're exaggerating - you didn't understand/misinterpreted a situation - you're spreading some rumors you heard The only one missing came from ShaLeah and others, which is "you're trying to get people to quit the game". These people have associated reinforcement of their beliefs with honesty, and criticism with dishonesty. |
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tedium
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Post by tedium on Sept 22, 2019 19:24:17 GMT -5
Wow what GDB boot-licking goon rushed to Arm's defense with the "well it's not IlLeGaL so its fine" argument? Typical sycophantic staffpets defending the game's flaws with nonsensical arguments.
lol
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2019 20:23:16 GMT -5
Well. It has become known that someone is making fake accounts to write fake shit up. Its to be expected that there is a level of disbelief.
The issue though is not the one thats worth fighting over. I am leaning in the direction that its fake though. The person claimed they sent the request in and they didnt. So its the same thing as whistleblower BS. Possibly the same person. Tugging on the ugly strings that nobody wants to really touch. Throwing shade.
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punished ppurg
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Post by punished ppurg on Sept 22, 2019 21:00:58 GMT -5
Provide evidence a complaint wasn't submitted. From the voice of a legitimate staff member. Your statement that a complaint was not submitted is immaterial, as you're not speaking as a staff member.
To come here on your damage control mask alt and throw out immaterial statements is cowardice.
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jkarr
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Post by jkarr on Sept 22, 2019 21:15:55 GMT -5
Provide evidence a complaint wasn't submitted. From the voice of a legitimate staff member. Your statement that a complaint was not submitted is immaterial, as you're not speaking as a staff member. To come here on your damage control mask alt and throw out immaterial statements is cowardice. and ultimately just unsubstantiated 'whistleblower bs' |
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